2013 Owners Recall Poll and Comments

[Magdave]

We have all seen the recall thread go south with the usual fanboys stepping in telling us 2013 owners how we should think and feel about what is going on. I read the 21 page directions on the installation. I have seen the pictures. I want to hear from 2013 OWNERS and what their thoughts are. Not 2014 not 2012 or 11. The poll is to see what 2013 owners think about the "fix".

I think there may be improvement from what I see and read but the cheap UNPAINTED VENT disturbs me. It should match the color of the bike IMHO. Another thing is how many owners think their dealers techs will complete the install correctly? I have doubts about mine so I am waiting till they do a few I simply refuse to be a test pilot for BRP and my dealer any longer. Sooo what are your thoughts? I would also like to hear from the early adopters with their results and impressions after it is completed. Thanks in advance to 2013 owners who post on this.

[Dan McNally]

Since you asked . . .

If I didn't trust my dealer's techs to do this recall, I wouldn't trust them to do anything else on my Spyder . . . I already stopped going to the dealer 37 miles from my home in favor of one in another state, 90 miles away, because my original dealer's technician lost my confidence.

As for the black scoops, just part of the resolution process, having never seen one, yet, I have no way to determine if it is "cheap" or not so I will reserve judgment on the part quality.

With regard to it being black, the bottom half of my mirror is black and the vent the scoop is replacing is black . . . and there are plenty of black "unpainted" parts on our Spyders (dash, handlebars, passenger grab bars, speakers . . . ) so I don't feel it will clash with any of the color schemes.

I'm looking forward to getting the work done and hoping it resolves the issues . . . as is the NHTSA which will be looking over BRPs shoulders as this progresses, to ensure the recall does what it is designed to do . . .

In the mean time, I spent the whole day, yesterday, ryding my Spyder . . . because that is why I bought it.

[KennW]

I'll jump in first if I may ??

Have read all of the instructions and viewed included photographs. Unfortunately a great deal of the technical items just flew straight over the top of my head but a few items stuck and am being very positive in that riding my 2013 RT in mid summer should be much more enjoyable.
As far as being stuck in traffic I don't really understand what's being changed I'd going to help then.
The new vents, or as some have referred to them "snorkels" look pretty cool on the photographs I've seen where they were fitted on a blue and a white RT.
My RT is black current so for me the colour of vents really isn't an issue.
One thing I will be watching though is after riding in prolonged wet weather is where the water penertrates and whether this may course unforeseen problems.
Also I would be more than happy to be the first to have my RT done at my dealership as I would like to think that the instructions would more likely be followed step by step to ensure they understand the process whereas future RT's may be done from memory and pushed through the process with undue care.

That's my two cents worth anyway.
Really interested to hear of other owners experience.

[robmorg]

Good idea for a thread, Dave. I think you should do another one with just 2013 RT owners in about a month from now to get impressions AFTER the work is done. It'll be interesting to compare the two.

As you probably know, I've already added plenty of heat reflective shielding around the seat, on the the backs of the panels adjacent to the seat, and around the fuel tank. Also removed the cat (primary muffler), and wrapped the headers and cat bypass pipe. Those mods have made a big difference, but I still get lots of heat at slow speeds and I didn't do anything to lessen the heat at the "dragon's mouth".

I think the new larger vents, along with the removal of the acoustic panels, will make a significant difference, in that it should be much more effective at venting the engine compartment. I also think that the combination of improved air flow, and the changes in the fuel system will probably go a long way toward resolving the vaporizing fuel issue and the associated canister issues, like the ones you are dealing with.

I'm guessing, from the pictures, that the new vent covers are a two-tone mat black with polished black trim pieces. If so, I think that will look alright. After seeing the pictures, I'm not necessarily concerned about the look of them (but, of course, I haven't seen them up close on my bike yet.) I have a pretty good dealer, so I'm not too concerned about the installation if they put the right techs on it. That said, I also opted to wait a month or two while they "get some practice". I can afford to do that since I've already mitigated a large portion of the heat issues as described above.

Since I have not altered my Spyder in any way that should effect the work described in the Warranty Bulletin, I am having the entire campaign done to my bike, in the hopes that this "fix", along with what I've already done, will ultimately resolve most all of the issues. That said, my main concern from just reading the Warranty Bulletin, is that they did not properly address the comfort issues. I still feel that we will probably have the "right foot" problem; probably less, but some, heat remaining around the seat; and I don't believe anything in "the fix" addresses the heat build-up in stop & go traffic, or very slow speeds. We'll see.

[cuznjohn]

interesting poll

[SNOOPY]

I'm guessing you're speaking of a RT or RS ?

I don't know about any scoops or recent recall on a ST.

[robmorg]

Dave is asking about the current campaign on JUST the 2013 RT's. The Warranty Bulletin, dated 5/26/15, was issued only a few days ago.

[SNOOPY]

Thanks

[rtotten]

I have a 2013 RT and took it in Thursday for a 3K mile service, course I was a little over due at 5K. Anyways, they asked when I wanted it back, course I said the weather is turning nice, and Friday is my retirement day, so the sooner the better. They did not the have the recall kits in yet anyways, I really did not want to be the first one done, but they have a top notch mechanic, but still. So, Friday about 4:30 I got this phone call saying they have been working all day putting my kit on my bike and they would not be finished tonight, and the mechanic might come in on Saturday to finish it up otherwise it would be done on Monday. Well, wouldn't you know it I had a migraine on Saturday morning. So I took my meds, went back to sleep. Dealer calls me about 10:30am, saying they are finished with my bike and I can come and pick it up. I tell them I will be there. I am excited, but am in no shape to ride. I go back to bed for a couple of hours. I get up around 1:00pm and my migraine is eased up enough for me to ride it home. So off my wife and I go. I had a chance to talk to the mechanic, he was impressed with fuel management changes that they made. I was worried before how the vents would look, but after seeing them, I really like them. My bike does seem to be a bit louder but not much. The bike seems to run smoother. When I shut it down, the fan was really loud and ran a bit longer. Overall I am glad I got it it done. Today, Sunday, I had another migraine, so I was not able to go out for a ride at all. Tomorrow, if I am able the wife ( she has her own spyder) and I are going on a 150 mile ride. Will give a ride update.

[daviszoo1]

We have all seen the recall thread go south with the usual fanboys stepping in telling us 2013 owners how we should think and feel about what is going on. I read the 21 page directions on the installation. I have seen the pictures. I want to hear from 2013 OWNERS and what their thoughts are. Not 2014 not 2012 or 11. The poll is to see what 2013 owners think about the "fix".

I think there may be improvement from what I see and read but the cheap UNPAINTED VENT disturbs me. It should match the color of the bike IMHO. Another thing is how many owners think their dealers techs will complete the install correctly? I have doubts about mine so I am waiting till they do a few I simply refuse to be a test pilot for BRP and my dealer any longer. Sooo what are your thoughts? I would also like to hear from the early adopters with their results and impressions after it is completed. Thanks in advance to 2013 owners who post on this.

Here we go, I am fairly confident BRP will resolve the canister/fume issues. How the remapping of the system remains to be seen. I do not believe the hot foot issue will go away from the bulletin that I looked over. From my early days in the garage (pumping gas to earn my first car-also washing the customers windshield)(gives you an idea of how ancient I am) point being the thermostat controls the cooling temperatures & therefore when the motor is up to temperature & the fan kicks in to cool the radiator down it will still vent the same way. One thing I have not seen discussed is what we went thru (our 2013 Rt Limited is my better halves ride) that she should be shifting at 4000 & upwards to be sure the purge valve would function. (fume & canister filling up). I realize the 990 is a rev happy motor but there are many times that reving that high are unnecessary. After many issues with our dealership not resolving or replacing the canister after the first go around I took the plunge & wrapped the pipes & added the insulation blanket where I was able. It really did help with the Tupperware/heat issues. Not so for the hot foot. My next step would have been a block off plate. Currently we are in the process of trading...That's my 2 cents...thanks for reading...

[Magdave]

Dave is asking about the current campaign on JUST the 2013 RT's. The Warranty Bulletin, dated 5/26/15, was issued only a few days ago.

I too have done some work on heat mitigation some similar to yours and I also kept it stock or easy off. Fixing the right foot is easy get a 2014 grille and cut the lower part so it works like a flap causing the air flow to go downward. The upper honey comb DOES redirect the air to outward a little away from your leg. If you haven't done it I highly suggest you give it a try the grille only costs $25.

Yes I do want to hear from everyone who has it done. My problem with dealer trust is from constant turn over. I don't want to train a 3rd one again. 3 service managers in 1 yr and asking me if my Spyder had a carb or was it fuel injected does not give me a warm fuzzy feeling after reading the tech bulletin. It will take someone with some decent Spyder experience and tech savy to get it done right the first time. Like all BRP instructions the pictures suck and the directions lack proper detail IMHO,

[robmorg]

Dave,

Thanks. I haven't really looked into the 2014 grill option, but I will. (Not really picturing what you are saying about "cutting the lower part so it works like a flap".) I've been reluctant to attack the right foot heat problem before now because I did not want to remove the lower plate, and given the choice of whether to let it come out the side vent onto my foot, or redirect it into the engine compartment, I thought it better to continue to let the radiator heat exit the bike at the vent. Frankly, the heat in the engine compartment has been much more of a concern to me than the heat on my foot. However, if it still bothers me after the recall is done, I will eventually look into resolving it.

I am disappointed that they did not relocate the radiator, or at least add a reversing fan, as part of this recall. It couldn't have been that difficult to add reversing fans, like they have on the 2014's. Maybe they didn't do it because they figured it wouldn't make enough of a difference with the radiator where it is.

[Magdave]

Dave,

Thanks. I haven't really looked into the 2014 grill option, but I will. (Not really picturing what you are saying about "cutting the lower part so it works like a flap".) I've been reluctant to attack the right foot heat problem before now because I did not want to remove the lower plate, and given the choice of whether to let it come out the side vent onto my foot, or redirect it into the engine compartment, I thought it better to continue to let the radiator heat exit the bike at the vent. Frankly, the heat in the engine compartment has been much more of a concern to me than the heat on my foot. However, if it still bothers me after the recall is done, I will eventually look into resolving it.

I am disappointed that they did not relocate the radiator, or at least add a reversing fan, as part of this recall. It couldn't have been that difficult to add reversing fans, like they have on the 2014's. Maybe they didn't do it because they figured it wouldn't make enough of a difference with the radiator where it is.

I think reversing the fan with the temp/pressure sensor in the 2013 location may have been an issue with fuel mapping making the ecm misread the ambient temp (it already reads higher that true ambient).







I cut the clips on the right side of the above pic do not need to do that. I also could have left a little more plastic on the bottom left so that side would have not let any heat pass through along the Tupperware and it still would work opening the right side and bottom pushes out. I will probably buy another one to make it that way but it works just fine with my Seal Dlx's

[Gray Ghost]

I am not stressing over the new fix. I was part of the experiment last fall, and thought then that there was a slight improvement but not enough to stop the gas boiling. A lot of people, including me, have said for a long time that there needs to be more air going to the engine to get the heat down. Looks to me like the scoops will do that. What I do plan on doing is taking off on a long trip at some point after the mod is done and keep track of temperatures on various parts of the byke, just like I did for the experiment last fall.

[Magdave]

I am not stressing over the new fix. I was part of the experiment last fall, and thought then that there was a slight improvement but not enough to stop the gas boiling. A lot of people, including me, have said for a long time that there needs to be more air going to the engine to get the heat down. Looks to me like the scoops will do that. What I do plan on doing is taking off on a long trip at some point after the mod is done and keep track of temperatures on various parts of the byke, just like I did for the experiment last fall.

Exactly what I will do too I have all my temp readings pics in my album to compare to. I agree more air in the engine bay should help as well as the canister move. Not sure if boiling gas will go away though especially in stop and go traffic with the cat still cooking. I may look at a cat bypass after all the recall work is done.

[ARtraveler]

Here is hoping that the fix will be the answer. Also looking forward to reading about results in 30 days or so.

[SpyderAnn01]

I have a 2013 RT and took it in Thursday for a 3K mile service, course I was a little over due at 5K. Anyways, they asked when I wanted it back, course I said the weather is turning nice, and Friday is my retirement day, so the sooner the better. They did not the have the recall kits in yet anyways, I really did not want to be the first one done, but they have a top notch mechanic, but still. So, Friday about 4:30 I got this phone call saying they have been working all day putting my kit on my bike and they would not be finished tonight, and the mechanic might come in on Saturday to finish it up otherwise it would be done on Monday. Well, wouldn't you know it I had a migraine on Saturday morning. So I took my meds, went back to sleep. Dealer calls me about 10:30am, saying they are finished with my bike and I can come and pick it up. I tell them I will be there. I am excited, but am in no shape to ride. I go back to bed for a couple of hours. I get up around 1:00pm and my migraine is eased up enough for me to ride it home. So off my wife and I go. I had a chance to talk to the mechanic, he was impressed with fuel management changes that they made. I was worried before how the vents would look, but after seeing them, I really like them. My bike does seem to be a bit louder but not much. The bike seems to run smoother. When I shut it down, the fan was really loud and ran a bit longer. Overall I am glad I got it it done. Today, Sunday, I had another migraine, so I was not able to go out for a ride at all. Tomorrow, if I am able the wife ( she has her own spyder) and I are going on a 150 mile ride. Will give a ride update.

Rick: I think you may be the first to actually have the work done. Thanks for the review.

[Commander]

AT this point I would have to say my glass is half full. Hoping for the best and looking forward to a good riding season

[Huddleston]

Here are my thoughts, for whatever they are worth.

I do plan to have as much of the recall done that can be done to my RTS. However, I have the aftermarket breather, cat bypass, and canisterectomy done. If they are required to reinstall a canister, I will let them do that, and when I get home remove it. I will not allow the bulky airbox to be installed, as I no longer have it. I already have Vertika Vents installed and have already removed the right and left acoustic panels a while back. That clearly cools the engine while moving at highway speed. I plan to allow the new vents to be installed and put my Vertika Vents up for sale. The Vertika Vents use only the existing hole (but there is no reason a larger hole can't be cut), so cutting a larger hole for the new vents should provide more airflow. It remains to be seen whether the fuel management changes will help with the heat at slow speed or idle, and I remain skeptical about its efficacy.

I do plan to install the right foot grill and panel to help cool the right foot, as I am highly doubtful that anything they do will address that issue. I probably will remove portions of the bottom panel to allow hot air to escape down, but need to see what the fix attaches to that area.

In summary, I will allow the fix to be applied, but remain highly skeptical.

[vtrider]

My dealer has ordered the kits for this recall and will schedule me in for an appointment to get the recall work done once the kits are in stock. I've posted in other threads that I haven't had the bad heat issues that some people have had with there 2013 RT's. In fact I really enjoy my 2013 RT LTD and have kept all the service on it up to date. To be honest, when I had my 2008 GS I felt that that riding that in high temps gave me more heat related issues than my 2013 RT. I can remember when riding the GS, especially when the temps reached into the 90's and humid, it would often go into limp mode, have loss of power, engine sputter, you name it. When I was able to start moving faster it would run fine. In the cooler temps it never gave me any issues. But all in all my GS was a very good spyder and I enjoyed owning it. My only regret was getting rid of it and wish I had kept it. That was the past and my decision to trade it at that time. Now that I've had the 2013 RT for a while, I can say it's been a pleasure to ride and I have no regrets so far in owning it. My biggest concern for me in this recall is not how the new air scoops will look, I'm fine with that and actually like the look. I have more of a concern of how the RT will sound with the acoustic panels removed. Will the sound be louder coming from the engine compartment? Time will tell once several of the RT's get the work done. I will keep up with this update on my 2013 RT and give a report once the work is done. For now, I will continue to ride and enjoy it. That is why I bought it in the first place.

[CruiseRT]

From what I have seen I don't see it stopping the boiling gas and my question is how hot is it going to be after they remove the adjustable air vents. With the fixed vents it got pretty hot, opening the vents made a big difference (not an option anymore). I did wrap my pipes more so for noise, but also to help the heat on the gas tank. Reprogramming the fuel may make it run better but is not going to help very much with the gas tank sitting on the exhaust pipe. Maybe I missed something but it looks like it will help somethings sometimes and hurt somethings sometime.

[Bob Denman]

I don't know about any scoops or recent recall on a ST.

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/s...-for-2013-ST-S
53 posts... one with pictures of the new scoops on your own ST.

[jcthorne]

From what I have seen I don't see it stopping the boiling gas and my question is how hot is it going to be after they remove the adjustable air vents. With the fixed vents it got pretty hot, opening the vents made a big difference (not an option anymore). I did wrap my pipes more so for noise, but also to help the heat on the gas tank. Reprogramming the fuel may make it run better but is not going to help very much with the gas tank sitting on the exhaust pipe. Maybe I missed something but it looks like it will help somethings sometimes and hurt somethings sometime.

The changes being made to the ECM have more to do with a complete revision of fuel pressure control than remapping of air/fuel tables. It is BRPs belief that a large portion of the heat added to the fuel in the tank is NOT from the exhaust but from the hot fuel returning from the mechanical fuel pressure regulator. BRP is eliminating the fuel pressure regulator and the fuel return and going to a PWM controlled fuel pump like the 2014 and newer bikes use. Thus the pump only delivers the fuel needed at any given time rather than what would be required at WOT all the time, and the throttle body where the regulator is located is HOT as are the metal fuel lines around the engine. Not returning this heat to the tank and its very small volume is what they are counting on to reduce fuel temps and stop the fuming. I am skeptical but hopeful. It has been tested and observed by NHTSA to be functional.

Louise 2013 RT is at the dealer now getting the recall done. They will work around the JT air cleaner as it only makes the job easier for them. Mechanic was a bit unsure on where to place the new evap after filter but was confident he would find an appropriate place since my bottom sound panels are long gone. We hope to get the bike back later in the week.

We also brought them a list and receipts for the heat reduction work we had already done. They were aware of how to submit to BRP for consideration but were unsure how it would turn out. Dealer credit is fine for me as my F3 initial service is coming up and needs to be documented at the dealer anyway.

We intend to give the new evap system a try, only removing it if we again get bad fumes sitting in traffic. If it works, I'll leave it be.

[RBS66]

Getting done and HOPE IT WORKS!!! There was no choice in the poll for my answer.

[CruiseRT]

The changes being made to the ECM have more to do with a complete revision of fuel pressure control than remapping of air/fuel tables. It is BRPs belief that a large portion of the heat added to the fuel in the tank is NOT from the exhaust but from the hot fuel returning from the mechanical fuel pressure regulator. BRP is eliminating the fuel pressure regulator and the fuel return and going to a PWM controlled fuel pump like the 2014 and newer bikes use. Thus the pump only delivers the fuel needed at any given time rather than what would be required at WOT all the time, and the throttle body where the regulator is located is HOT as are the metal fuel lines around the engine. Not returning this heat to the tank and its very small volume is what they are counting on to reduce fuel temps and stop the fuming. I am skeptical but hopeful. It has been tested and observed by NHTSA to be functional.

Louise 2013 RT is at the dealer now getting the recall done. They will work around the JT air cleaner as it only makes the job easier for them. Mechanic was a bit unsure on where to place the new evap after filter but was confident he would find an appropriate place since my bottom sound panels are long gone. We hope to get the bike back later in the week.

We also brought them a list and receipts for the heat reduction work we had already done. They were aware of how to submit to BRP for consideration but were unsure how it would turn out. Dealer credit is fine for me as my F3 initial service is coming up and needs to be documented at the dealer anyway.

We intend to give the new evap system a try, only removing it if we again get bad fumes sitting in traffic. If it works, I'll leave it be.

Thanks for the reply, maybe the fix of removing the hot return fuel will stop the boiling gas. Still curious how much air the rider will lose after removing the adjustable vents. Maybe someone from down your way can give us an opinion after they have the recall done. I'm sure it already hot down there. I called my dealer the day BRP announced the fix and they did not know much about it, so I will give them a few more days and give them another call.