The 2015's - My Thoughts on the Negative Reactions

[MRH]

I've been reading the many negative reactions to the 2015 lineup over the last week or so, and wanted to share some general thoughts. There seemed to be a set of expectations this year that everybody would get the upgrades they wanted. I get it, I've got a 2014 RT and it was a very significant upgrade to my 2010.

What I've also noticed over time is that significant changes often come with engineering issues that we and BRP have to strugle with. The 2013 RT, arguably, caught the issues that would have otherwise been a problem in the 2014. My 2010 certainly had issues. So, it seems, do most new model years or years after significant changes. The F3 looks amazing - with a touring package I'd probably like it better than my RT, but I'll have to accept having a bike I love instead of one I might love even more.

BRP, it would seem, has a finite amount of resources (and there are certainly a finite amount of sales for the niche we call a Spyder). This year they introduced something completely new, and I'm sure they've done their general best to make it as problem free as possible (although I'm also sure they'll be a recall or two and a few significant issues on the first model year, despite those efforts). Customer service, as well, requires resources. I want BRP to have what it needs to fix problems and right wrongs quickly and efficiently.

Had BRP, at the same time as they introduced the F3, reworked the ST or RS for the 1330 engine, I'm pretty sure that six months from now there would be issues with every model year. Dividing their resources and trying to bite off too much couldn't possibly help the quality of the product, and even if they could multiply their resources then they would still be confronted by the normal issues with making major changes.

Ideally, yes, it would all be bulletproof. And, yes, their customer service is getting better but there are still often challenges if you have a truly bad apple. As a small business owner I've learned that what looks easy on the outside can be very difficult to actually achieve in real life, and when you have to rely on others (dealers, in this case), you can do your best and still end up looking bad. To be clear, I'm not defending bad customer service when it happens, but it does help to understand how complex some of this really can be.

I do get it, the 1330 in six gears is something just about everybody wants, and the F3 and RT aren't for everybody. They have added some bold color choices (most of which I like, although there are one or two combination that puzzle me, but in those cases a 2014 would be a bargain to buy and be essentially the same bike). To grow, BRP needs to reach a larger market, and that will benefit us all. I really think the F3 will do that, and making the RS more "fun" may indeed appeal to a younger demographic. I'm 49, which actually puts me in the younger group on this board, and there are plenty of people younger than me, who, like me, would love being on a motorcycle but can't or don't want to take the full level of risk that accompanies having just two wheels. You aren't going to miss many of those new colors on the road, and that also may help keep us safer.

I think BRP deserves a little bit of grace on not giving us everything we want this year, and instead we ought to have the reasonable expectations that what they do invest in producing has been well tested and engineered, and that the very positive direction that many of us have experienced in their customer service will continue to move towards excellence.

[Bob Denman]

" To grow, BRP needs to reach a larger market, and that will benefit us all. I really think the F3 will do that, and making the RS more "fun" may indeed appeal to a younger demographic."

[PrairieSpyder]

Well said!

[WackyDan]

I've been reading the many negative reactions to the 2015 lineup over the last week or so, and wanted to share some general thoughts. There seemed to be a set of expectations this year that everybody would get the upgrades they wanted. I get it, I've got a 2014 RT and it was a very significant upgrade to my 2010.

What I've also noticed over time is that significant changes often come with engineering issues that we and BRP have to strugle with. The 2013 RT, arguably, caught the issues that would have otherwise been a problem in the 2014. My 2010 certainly had issues. So, it seems, do most new model years or years after significant changes. The F3 looks amazing - with a touring package I'd probably like it better than my RT, but I'll have to accept having a bike I love instead of one I might love even more.


BRP, it would seem, has a finite amount of resources (and there are certainly a finite amount of sales for the niche we call a Spyder). This year they introduced something completely new, and I'm sure they've done their general best to make it as problem free as possible (although I'm also sure they'll be a recall or two and a few significant issues on the first model year, despite those efforts). Customer service, as well, requires resources. I want BRP to have what it needs to fix problems and right wrongs quickly and efficiently.

Had BRP, at the same time as they introduced the F#, reworked the ST or RS for the 1330 engine, I'm pretty sure that six months from now there would be issues with every model year. Dividing their resources and trying to bite off too much couldn't possibly help the quality of the product, and even if they could multiply their resources then they would still be confronted by the normal issues with making major changes.


Ideally, yes, it would all be bulletproof. And, yes, their customer service is getting better but there are still often challenges if you have a truly bad apple. As a small business owner I've learned that what looks easy on the outside can be very difficult to actually achieve in real life, and when you have to rely on others (dealers, in this case), you can do your best and still end up looking bad. To be clear, I'm defending bad customer service when it happens, but it does help to understand how complex some of this really can be.


I do get it, the 1330 in six gears is something just about everybody wants, and the F3 and RT aren't for everybody. They have added some bold color choices (most of which I like, although there are one or two combination that puzzle me, but in those cases a 2014 would be a bargain to buy and be essentially the same bike). To grow, BRP needs to reach a larger market, and that will benefit us all. I really think the F3 will do that, and making the RS more "fun" may indeed appeal to a younger demographic. I'm 49, which actually puts me in the younger group on this board, and there are plenty of people younger than me, who, like me, would love being on a motorcycle but can't or don't want to take the full level of risk that accompanies having just two wheels. You aren't going to miss many of those new colors on the road, and that also may help keep us safer.


I think BRP deserves a little bit of grace on not giving us everything we want this year, and instead we ought to have the reasonable expectations that what they do invest in producing has been well tested and engineered, and that the very positive direction that many of us have experienced in their customer service will continue to move towards excellence.

Well said, but sometimes a manufacturer builds and markets one product while neglecting to advance another in order to drive unit sales of the new shiny one.

In BRP's case, that may prove successful. I've wanted more power and range for a long time. The RT isn't for me, but the ST with the 1330 and mature aftermarket would have been perfect. I would have plunked down my money and called it done. It just doesn't make sense to buy an ST with the 991 series twin in it when that is essentially what I have now with the GS and the 990 series.

The F3 is a compromise of sorts. Far less storage and when I say that, it means that adding a top case would be detrimental to the overall look of the bike - unless one is made that is large enough and specifically tailored to the look of the F3. I still haven't seen the size specifications of the side cases yet.

So the F3 is growing on me, but I'd have to alter what I pack and the way I pack for long trips ( I do not want to tow a trailer). It has much of what I want, but as a touring bike it just isn't set up the way I can rig an ST and that is the rub for me.

If the F3 doesn't blow my skirt up after riding it and seeing some aftermarket options, I'm still faced with keeping the out of warranty GS another year, or going back to two wheels. *But if BRP had put the 1330 in the ST a lot of us wouldn't even consider buying an F3 which goes back to my original point.

[BikerDoc]

What an accurate right on comment

[MRH]

Well said, but sometimes a manufacturer builds and markets one product while neglecting to advance another in order to drive unit sales of the new shiny one.

In BRP's case, that may prove successful. I've wanted more power and range for a long time. The RT isn't for me, but the ST with the 1330 and mature aftermarket would have been perfect. I would have plunked down my money and called it done. It just doesn't make sense to buy an ST with the 991 series twin in it when that is essentially what I have now with the GS and the 990 series.

The F3 is a compromise of sorts. Far less storage and when I say that, it means that adding a top case would be detrimental to the overall look of the bike - unless one is made that is large enough and specifically tailored to the look of the F3. I still haven't seen the size specifications of the side cases yet.

So the F3 is growing on me, but I'd have to alter what I pack and the way I pack for long trips ( I do not want to tow a trailer). It has much of what I want, but as a touring bike it just isn't set up the way I can rig an ST and that is the rub for me.

If the F3 doesn't blow my skirt up after riding it and seeing some aftermarket options, I'm still faced with keeping the out of warranty GS another year, or going back to two wheels. *But if BRP had put the 1330 in the ST a lot of us wouldn't even consider buying an F3 which goes back to my original point.

Had they upgraded the ST (which is still a newer model, and would only reasonably be upgraded along with or after the RS), would you be confident in making the upgrade given the much higher chances that there would be engineering issues due splitting the limited resources the company has for this product?

[Dragonrider]

I would have expected the RSS to have new plastic, to deal with the on-going heat issues. Perhaps the F3 is intended to replace the RSS? They play in the same sandbox - similar accessories, look, pricing, and target market.

[bscrive]

I don't think everyone wants the 1330. The RSS guys/gals want more power out of the engine. They want a true sport bike. Maybe adding a turbo or something to get that power to the 991. As for the ST series, my wife likes her STL the way that it is. It gets good fuel mileage and it is fun for her to ride. She doen't care much for the 1330 because it is not going to make her riding any more enjoyable. It will keep up to and pass any RT out there.

I hope that BRP listens and gives the sport Spyders riders what they want.......MORE POWER.......BRP THINK HAYABUSA and you will be on the right track.

[Indyron]

Sure is refreshing to read a mature and intelligent discussion on SL, thanks to all!

[ARtraveler]

I think the OP post was right on for a lot of us.

That said, I would rather see BRP go "low and slow" than try to push a bunch of stuff through at once.

The 1330 turned out to be a charm. Many of us beta tested (through our purchases of the 2014 RT) and it turned out well. The 1330 should work very well in the F3's.

It will be interesting to see what 2016 brings. Time for another project to be in the works.

[WackyDan]

Had they upgraded the ST (which is still a newer model, and would only reasonably be upgraded along with or after the RS), would you be confident in making the upgrade given the much higher chances that there would be engineering issues due splitting the limited resources the company has for this product?

YES. The 1330 isn't new anymore. I bought a 2008 GS new out of the crate didn't I?

[mtdoragary]

I just feel really blessed that I had to give up my Harley right when the 2014's showed up with all of their great improvements! I can't complain about my Rt Limited. It suits me perfectly! OK, so I added a nearly a thousand dollars worth of lights and armrests. What Harley ever remained stock????

[Marker]

I like the new F3 . I think its going for the cruiser crowd . I also noticed that with the "UFIT" system its like going to a Harley Dealer and having choices of different handlebars to make your ride more comfortable
The F3 is not for me but I like it . I like the new RS and ST color combinations combinations, i like BRP going out to mix up the colors and combinations hope that attracts some new riders.
I am going to order a new 2015 RT limited ,I wish the RS and ST color combinations were available but there not so I am going to make it my own so stay tuned for that.

[WackyDan]

I don't think everyone wants the 1330. The RSS guys/gals want more power out of the engine. They want a true sport bike. Maybe adding a turbo or something to get that power to the 991. As for the ST series, my wife likes her STL the way that it is. It gets good fuel mileage and it is fun for her to ride. She doen't care much for the 1330 because it is not going to make her riding any more enjoyable. It will keep up to and pass any RT out there.

I hope that BRP listens and gives the sport Spyders riders what they want.......MORE POWER.......BRP THINK HAYABUSA and you will be on the right track.

But with the 991 she'll be stopping for gas before the 2014 RT's. That was another reason many of us want the 1330 in the ST. In the ST it will give the RS a run for it's money and finally give us the range.

[robmorg]

Well said, but sometimes a manufacturer builds and markets one product while neglecting to advance another in order to drive unit sales of the new shiny one.

In BRP's case, that may prove successful. I've wanted more power and range for a long time. The RT isn't for me, but the ST with the 1330 and mature aftermarket would have been perfect. I would have plunked down my money and called it done. It just doesn't make sense to buy an ST with the 991 series twin in it when that is essentially what I have now with the GS and the 990 series.

The F3 is a compromise of sorts. Far less storage and when I say that, it means that adding a top case would be detrimental to the overall look of the bike - unless one is made that is large enough and specifically tailored to the look of the F3. I still haven't seen the size specifications of the side cases yet.

So the F3 is growing on me, but I'd have to alter what I pack and the way I pack for long trips ( I do not want to tow a trailer). It has much of what I want, but as a touring bike it just isn't set up the way I can rig an ST and that is the rub for me.

If the F3 doesn't blow my skirt up after riding it and seeing some aftermarket options, I'm still faced with keeping the out of warranty GS another year, or going back to two wheels. *But if BRP had put the 1330 in the ST a lot of us wouldn't even consider buying an F3 which goes back to my original point.

Dan,

I think all you have to do is wait another year - perhaps two. BRP couldn't change everything in one year. A dealer who was at the dealer show last week told me that the F3 is, among other things, a transitional model. He says BRP hinted that as the line moves forward, in coming years, ALL the models will transition to F3-like features... i.e. the lighter tubular frame, the 1330 engine, the F3 suspension improvements, and some form of the new UFit feature.

[OldCowboy]

Personally, I really like the F3. If I were buying a today, that is probably the one I'd buy. I'd likely go with the Touring Escape package because when my wife is with me, we are usually on day trips. When I go for an overnighter, there's plenty of room on the passenger pillion for a large bag.

[flamingobabe]

some place...somewhere I read that the newer models RS, RSS,ST are going to be put on the F3 platform.....I like the f3.....I like the tri-colors on the ST....what about a ST pink....turquoise...black...oh baby I would be there

[QFortune]

I've been ridding my 2014 rt-limited now since April of this year. Even rode it cross country and I didn't move on a Spyder (meaning to buy one) till they upgraded the engine size! When they introduced the 1330, I told my wife "that's it! I'm going to the dealer!" Have not regretted it since... Can't lie though, when I saw the new F3 version I fell in [emoji173]️ instantly, my family, not so much. But had I waited another 6 months, they would have told me to go for the F3, at least that's how I see the conversation going in my head...lol

Bottom line, the F3 is a transition vehicle and an opportunity for them to work out the kinks for the other versions and deliver a quality product... Just an observation because I have been obsessing about this bike since I first saw the teasers for it way back in 2005!!!

Update: heading to the motorcycle show in longbeach to check out the new F3 in the metal!!!!
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1416159830.534214.jpg

[billrob71]

I like some of the 15 line up, the ST in all blue and the RT SS in red and black look real nice, F3 looks interesting , waiting to see one at the dealer but not ditching my RSS anytime soon. Its sad that nothing was changed on the RSS model except those colors and I think they would of been pretty nice if they didnt add the red/orange to the other colors think that just ruins the look of the bike. Would like to see the sport potnetial come out with a bigger power plant and lesser nanny control. THATS GOING TO BE THE ONLY WAY TO SWAY ME TO A NEW BIKE!!!!!!! and don't think a 1330 would be the motor of choice for a sport model, touring/towing model sure.

[StanProff]

I like the new F3 . I think its going for the cruiser crowd . I also noticed that with the "UFIT" system its like going to a Harley Dealer and having choices of different handlebars to make your ride more comfortable
The F3 is not for me but I like it . I like the new RS and ST color combinations combinations, i like BRP going out to mix up the colors and combinations hope that attracts some new riders.
I am going to order a new 2015 RT limited ,I wish the RS and ST color combinations were available but there not so I am going to make it my own so stay tuned for that.

Same here, I like the F3 but it is not for me. I came off of a two wheel cruiser to the RT riding style for a reason. I like the riding position. I still have a couple of cruiser style bikes and from time to time ride them but it's the touring style that I am most comfortable on. (that goes for my wife also).
By the way, I have always liked the color combo on your 2010

[Dan_Ashley]

I love my 2012 RT-S, and I plan to keep it. I also plan to buy an F3 as soon as I can get one delivered.

[Chupaca]

Great observation... got nothing negative to say but am also happy with my RS. Don't know why some that are not going to change have to find fault...maybe to justify to themselves not getting one...

[OJ UK]

Well I'm going to stick my neck out and say that the F3 is an addition to the range and is not going to replace any existing model.

I also think that within two years the V-Twin will be phased out and the in-line triple will be found in all models.

The triple by its nature is easy to set-up in many different ways and will power a 'balls-out' sports machine just as well
as a gentler version in a tourer. ( I am and always have been a fan of 3 cylinder motors!)

So wait for the RSS to have a free-breathing 1330 motor and the six speed box...should be fun.

The F3 accessories list is already quite impressive and the after market manufacturers will be designing farkles and
accessories for it even as I type.

Me?? I'm going to get an F3 S just as soon as they hit the UK shores...I'm told March.

Sure! I'll miss the frunk as a place to store my helmet and as a shopping basket, the F3 has only 24 liters storage
up front but I'll get over it!

[den1953]

Keep in mind the fact I've never yet owned a Can AM Spyder but have demoed three of them (the original in 2008 and a 2013 RT-S as well as a 2014 RT-S). Now consider where I'm at having had 16 motorcycles in 44 years, the last seven being cruisers. At 61 years of age my knees and back don't like to bend anymore and the cruiser riding position agrees with me. The new 2015 Spyder F3 has me interested in a much bigger way than the RT did as it will fit me like an old shoe or a well broken in pair of blue jeans. The aggressive looks at first were a bit off-putting but now I have grown to like it. I am anxiously awaiting the arrival of the first F3 at my dealer so I can actually see it in the flesh so-to-speak and get a chance to check-out the riding position and weather permitting even get a demo ride on it.

[Marker]

Same here, I like the F3 but it is not for me. I came off of a two wheel cruiser to the RT riding style for a reason. I like the riding position. I still have a couple of cruiser style bikes and from time to time ride them but it's the touring style that I am most comfortable on. (that goes for my wife also).
By the way, I have always liked the color combo on your 2010

Thanks StanProf I like the color too , The yellow really pops out when you see it against the timeless black. I traded my spyder in on a 2015 Rt Limited Black and my dealer was disappointed that I removed the graphics before I traded it in. I am trying to figure out what to do with my new spyder to make it my own.
Pete's Power Sports Wraps did a great job with the stripes and a local vinyl shop installed them for me.

I have a few health issues with my neck. On my Rt I can ride all day with no pain.