2011 front sprocket

[Tonga]

Normally, a design change is not covered as a warranty item. If you want the new sprocket/damper, I suspect you will have to pay for it.

Dampers are designed for a purpose and what I want to know is, Reliabilty or smoothnes ??? If it a reliabilty issue then early 2010 model owners should be told and it then is up to each to chose either way to get it or not.

[boborgera]

Normally, a design change is not covered as a warranty item. If you want the new sprocket/damper, I suspect you will have to pay for it.

I Agree,
If design changes were covered under warranty the Manufacturers would be given you a new Bike/car/truck every two/three years, Nice idea but it ain't happening.

[Lamonster]

Dampers are designed for a purpose and what I want to know is, Reliabilty or smoothnes ??? If it a reliabilty issue then early 2010 model owners should be told and it then is up to each to chose either way to get it or not.

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/s...ight=vibration

[Tonga]

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/s...ight=vibration

Thanks Lamont. Mine is not the SE so I will not worry about it. My Weather here in Florida Panhandle is finally warming up. I just came in from a nice ride.

[Raptor]

I guess I'm still confused here. By reading the thread that Lamont posted That pulley/flywheel package was a specialized application for the RT-SE to help with vibration in shifting and would not benefit the RT-SM or RS. However, We now see that 2011 RS models have that pulley/flywheel installed. The Math isn't adding up!
But ya know what? It's starting to turn into this So I'm going to just file it away. If enough people start blowing front sprockets, belts etc. I imagine BRP will have to do something about it. It would cost them too much money and bad PR to just keep replacing them with the current part(s) IF this is the trend moving forward. For now, we will party on!!

[docdoru]

More pictures on the 2011 RS front sprocket:

[Questions]

I am motorcycle technician and spyder owner and as such I am following this thread with interest. My interest lies with the sprockets failing prematurely which was common on Buells for a short while. While I no lon[php][/php]ger have a Buell I see similarities here. So I began to poke around a bit. Bear in mind this is very speculatory at this point.

In my informal research on this sprocket, it should be a bolt on affair.
unless I am wrong there has been no frame and swingarm changes nor has the belt design changed ie: tooth pitch/spacing. Additionally my studies indicate the motor has not been offset nor has the rear pulley. So I am thinking it will work. Should I need a pulley this is the one i'll try. What if anything might you think.

Kind regards Steve

[SpyderWolf]

Apparently there has also been a change to the 2011 clutch assembly to go along with this new front sprocket. I asked about it while my Spyder was in the shop for the new front sprocket, as if it was just a bolt on I was thinking about paying the extra and having them order this one. I was told that just switching the sprocket could cause damage to the stock clutch on the 2008 - 2010 models.

Sorry, but I don't have any technical details on this and am only repeating what I was told.

[docdoru]

Apparently there has also been a change to the 2011 clutch assembly to go along with this new front sprocket. I asked about it while my Spyder was in the shop for the new front sprocket, as if it was just a bolt on I was thinking about paying the extra and having them order this one. I was told that just switching the sprocket could cause damage to the stock clutch on the 2008 - 2010 models.

Sorry, but I don't have any technical details on this and am only repeating what I was told.

I'll research...

[Campverdefela]

If I recall correctly their hasn't been that many failures of the front sprocket and when they have failed it was mainly due to loosened bolt issues. Is this correct for the most part?

[SpyderWolf]

I'll research...

Please do, as I know many of us would like a definitive answer on this one. The question then becomes will it be worth it if you have to replace the clutch as well? That would make it over $1000 instead of just over $100, which is a huge difference.

[docdoru]

Please do, as I know many of us would like a definitive answer on this one. The question then becomes will it be worth it if you have to replace the clutch as well? That would make it over $1000 instead of just over $100, which is a huge difference.

2008 clutch:


2011 clutch:


The only discrepancy is a double #6 (420239395 Disc Spring).

[SpyderWolf]

That is very interesting, and I wonder what the extra disc spring does and how much of a difference it actually makes?

[spyryder]

The #7 thrust washer is also different.

[IWN2RYD]

I would like to see this enlarged. I also see notes or additional parts on the 2008 version...

[spyryder]

Here's the part #'s for the '08 and the '11....lots of different numbers including clutch plates:

2008 GS:
1 420627260 Thrust Washer 1
2 420634476 Oil Gear Pump, 42 Teeth 1
3 420259535 Clutch Drum 1
4 420295783 Primary Drive Gear Ass'y. Includes 4 to 5 1
5 XXX Drive Gear 1
6 420239390 Disc Spring 1
7 420627910 Thrust Washer 1
8 420259588 Inner Support Plate 1
9 420238135 Compression Spring 4
10 420238140 Internal Compression Spring 4
11 420238130 Compression Spring 2
12 420247972 Spring Retainer 8
13 420247974 Spring Retainer 4
14 420941835 Flat Head Screw, M8 X 25 3
15 420247614 Spacer Sleeve 3
16 420259583 Outer Support Plate 1
17 232081414 Hex. Nut M8 3
18 420627220 Thrust Washer 1
19 420259520 Hub Clutch 1
20 420245830 Spring Washer 1
21 420242950 Hex. Nut M24 1
22 420259265 Plate, 1.5 mm 1
23 420659800 Friction Plate, 3.5 mm 9
24 420259260 Clutch Plate, 1.5 mm 9
25 420659791 Pin 1
26 420259519 Pressure Plate Ass'y. Includes 26 to 27 1
27 420632135 Ball Bearing 1
28 420238721 Clutch Spring 6
29 420627530 Step Washer 6
30 420241825 Socket Head Screw M6 X 45 6
31 420227180 Thrust Washer 2
32 420627230 Disc Support 1
33 420260890 Diaphragm 1
34 420627281 Disc Plate 1
35 420642055 Hexagonal Nut M12 X 1 1
B 293800060 Loctite 243, 10 ml 1
C 413711400 Loctite 648, 10 ml 1
O XXX Engine Oil 1

2011 RS:
1 420627260 Thrust Washer 1
2 420634476 Oil Gear Pump, 42 Teeth 1
3a 420685850 Primary Drive Ass'y. Includes 3a to 17 1
3b 420259533 Clutch Drum 1
4 420295787 Primary Drive Gear. Includes 4 to 5 1
5 XXX Drive Gear 1
6 420239395 Disc Spring 1
7 420626810 Thrust Washer 1
8 420259685 Support Plate 1
9 420238135 Compression Spring 4
10 420238140 Internal Compression Spring 4
11 420238130 Compression Spring 2
12 420247972 Spring Retainer 8
13 420247976 Spring Retainer 4
14 420941835 Flat Head Screw, M8 X 25 3
15 420247614 Spacer Sleeve 3
16 420259583 Outer Support Plate 1
17 232081414 Hex. Nut M8 3
18 420627225 Thrust Washer 1
19 420259520 Hub Clutch 1
20 420245830 Spring Washer 1
21 420242950 Hex. Nut M24 1
22 420259266 Plate, 1.5 mm 1
23 420659800 Friction Plate, 3.5 mm 9
24 420259263 Clutch Plate, 1.5 mm 9
25 420659791 Pin 1
26 420259519 Pressure Plate Ass'y. Includes 26 to 27 1
27 420632135 Ball Bearing 1
28 420238721 Clutch Spring 6
29 420627530 Step Washer 6
30 420640315 Hex. Screw M6 X 45 6
31 420227180 Thrust Washer 2
32 420627230 Disc Support 1
33 420260891 Diaphragm 1
34 420627281 Disc Plate 1
35 420642055 Hexagonal Nut M12 X 1 1

[boborgera]

I would like to see this enlarged. I also see notes or additional parts on the 2008 version...

You can enlarge it By holding down the ctrl key and clicking the plus [+] key.

[SSG Bean]

Did anyone ever get a reliable answer on whether this will retrofit. I don't think a slight difference in the clutch should preclude this from fitting an 08. As long as the output shaft is the same, and there is not some sort of off-axis weight for external balancing of some kind, we should be fine. I may make this part of my next project, I was just hoping someone else had already been the guinea pig. Thanks in advance

[Firefly]

My take on the sprocket failure is that it is a combination problem of poorly made sprocket/shaft and way too high belt tension- as specified and then re- speced by BRP MUCH lower.

Mine second one is holding up fine, but with the previous shaft spline damage I question how long either will last.

I've also been told that BRP may or may not cover shaft replacement due to spline wear. This will not sit well with me should they not cover mine.

My take is it's not our fault they had us run way too high belt tensions for the first year or so.

[boborgera]

I've also been told that BRP may or may not cover shaft replacement due to spline wear. This will not sit well with me should they not cover mine.

My take is it's not our fault they had us run way too high belt tensions for the first year or so.

They did not cover my Sprocket and Shaft. I do under stand I'm out of the warranty period ,But at only 17400 miles they should have at least covered the parts. But all i can say is that BRP lost more than i did.

[Firefly]

I've still got a good year left on my 5 year warranty - and I know many others have had them covered under warranty- so I do expect mine to be covered due to precedent set by fixing others.

[tajohn]

Hi Dan,
I have learned from other Spyder owners that the 2011 RS/RT's have a newly designed front pulley with a damper. Can you inquire and advise as to what parts to order for you to install on our 09 SE5?
Since losing a belt after the new tension spec was applied I'm thinking we were not alone and they made a design add on for 2011.

Thanks,

Tim & Annamarie Johnson





I inquired to our dealer (Honda East Toledo) about the issue that we are discussing and this is his reply. Hope this will help.




Hello Tim and Annamarie, hope all is well with you-

There a few other parts including the flywheel that must be replaced with the new damper assy, failure to replace all listed parts will result in internal engine damage according to BRP. Here's the parts list.Part quantities preceed part #s
1-420685850-primary drive
1-705501250-flywheel
1-705501201-drive sprocket(if necessary)
1-420650330-clutch cover gasket
6-205884046-flywheel bolts
1-250000250-drive sprocket bolt
2-509000045-oetiker gear clamp
I have yet to price these parts, you can get a hold of the parts dept(James) for pricing.
Hope this helps - Dan

[Firefly]

Hi Dan,
I have learned from other Spyder owners that the 2011 RS/RT's have a newly designed front pulley with a damper. Can you inquire and advise as to what parts to order for you to install on our 09 SE5?
Since losing a belt after the new tension spec was applied I'm thinking we were not alone and they made a design add on for 2011.

Thanks,

Tim & Annamarie Johnson





I inquired to our dealer (Honda East Toledo) about the issue that we are discussing and this is his reply. Hope this will help.




Hello Tim and Annamarie, hope all is well with you-

There a few other parts including the flywheel that must be replaced with the new damper assy, failure to replace all listed parts will result in internal engine damage according to BRP. Here's the parts list.Part quantities preceed part #s
1-420685850-primary drive
1-705501250-flywheel
1-705501201-drive sprocket(if necessary)
1-420650330-clutch cover gasket
6-205884046-flywheel bolts
1-250000250-drive sprocket bolt
2-509000045-oetiker gear clamp
I have yet to price these parts, you can get a hold of the parts dept(James) for pricing.
Hope this helps - Dan

420685850 PRIMARY DRIVE ASSY $397.99
705501250 FLYWHEEL $59.49
705501201 SPROCKET 28 TE $79.99
420650330 GASKET $9.49
205884046 SCREW-SOCKET $8.94
250000250 SCREW-HEX.FLANGE $7.99
509000045 CRIMP CLAMP $7.98

Total
$571.87

[SSG Bean]

I'm curious if you can install just the front sprocket without the damper and keep all of the other parts stock for the 08. I know that most are probably wanting the damper, so they can reduce the vibrations. I am mainly just interested in having a sprocket with a flange on the inside and out to limit belt movement.

[docdoru]

I'm curious if you can install just the front sprocket without the damper and keep all of the other parts stock for the 08. I know that most are probably wanting the damper, so they can reduce the vibrations. I am mainly just interested in having a sprocket with a flange on the inside and out to limit belt movement.

I sugest everyone to go with the damper: all new 2011 and 2012 RS's are delivered now with the new front sprocket and damper (another "silence update" from brp). However, the belt velocity spectrum move on a logarithmic scale to the back sprocket: see example on a Commander with 34 hours: