Let the work begin... 2015 F3 with a new (used) engine being installed.

[Scottncol]

Through some great advice received here on Spyder Lovers and a later diagnosis from the mechanic, it was determined that my 1330 engine needed to be replaced.

https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...s-a-new-engine!

The previous owner attempted to change the plugs (no clue why) with CHAMPION spark plugs on the 2015 Spyder, with 10,000 miles, and broke a plug off into the #2 cylinder, doing ALL kinds of damage.

IMG_1029.jpg

So, the engine needed either rebuilt (WAY too much money) or I needed to replace the engine.

I found a 2019 engine, from a wrecked RT with 1096 miles on it, that I purchased.

https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...-a-1330-engine

I was able to swap the transmission cover and oil pump cover with my old engine so I would have the powder-coated finished. (yes, new gaskets were used).

IMG_1037.jpg

Today, I took it to my (not so) local dealer for the engine swap. When they saw the bike, they commented that it looked new and that the stickers will still on the bike. The technician told me that in ALL his years of working on this bike, he has seen ONE other engine go bad. It was similar situation, where user error caused the problems.

The swap will cost me about $2000. Because I was going to attempt the swap myself originally, I had purchased the oil kit, plugs, coolant, plastic plugs, etc. They agreed to use all of my supplies. Saves me a few bucks.

I will keep you posted and a HUGE thank you to the community for dealing with me during my frustrations and offering advice, even when I didn't want to face my issues.

Thanks again!

[BajaRon]

I don't understand how the spark plug ended up inside the cylinder. If you broke it off, it would still be threaded into the cylinder head. Not down in the engine.

I sold my 1971 Honda 750 4 cylinder bike in mint condition to a guy who was all excited about doing his own work. I told him I'd just given the bike a full tune-up and not to mess with anything. This included balancing the 4 carbs, valve adjustment, new spark plugs, the works. It was running like a sewing machine. I told him it was good for at least 10,000 miles or more. I told him to just ride it and enjoy.

He calls me that weekend saying it was running really badly and could I come over and see what was wrong with it. It was one of those dreaded moments where you think that some issue, unknown to you, had cropped up with the new owner. He then figuring I knew about some defect all along. Wouldn't blame him.

I get to his house and was escorted to the garage where the bike sat looking as good as ever. I asked him to start it up and it made the worst clattering, metal eating metal sound I'd ever heard from an engine. 'Shut it off!', I said immediately. I pulled the tank off to see what I could see and looking at the valve cover I noticed one of the valve adjustment access caps was brand new. These were round caps located just above each valve and sealed by an O-Ring. 4 along the front and 4 along the back.

I asked him why there was a new cap. He said he'd broken one. The only way this was possible, other than just hitting it with a hammer to smash it, was to tighten it to the point where it shattered. You never want to tighten an O-Ring sealed component more than snug. He must have really cranked down hard on that cap. I asked him why he was messing with it at all. He said he wanted to adjust the valves. I reminded him that I'd just done that and he said he just wanted to do it himself.

Abandoning that line of thought I asked him where the shattered parts from the original cap were. He said he tried to retrieve them trough the hole with a magnet. But that didn't work. (DUH! It's Aluminum!) An obvious fact which I didn't bother to mention.

"So," he says, "I just bought a new cap and put it on. I figured it would be OK."

I told him that those broken parts were destroying the engine and not to even crank it over at all until he corrects the problem. That the valve cover would have to come off and on that bike, you had to pull the engine to get the valve cover off. He wanted to work on his new bike, and he definitely accomplished that need.

I never heard from him again. I have a feeling that he sent that perfectly good machine to the motorcycle graveyard. That really hurt. Needless to say, I regretted selling that bike to him.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I don't understand how the spark plug ended up inside the cylinder. If you broke it off, it would still be threaded into the cylinder head. Not down in the engine.

I sold my 1971 Honda 750 4 cylinder bike in mint condition to a guy who was all excited about doing his own work. I told him I'd just given the bike a full tune-up and not to mess with anything. This included balancing the 4 carbs, valve adjustment, new spark plugs, the works. It was running like a sewing machine. I told him it was good for at least 10,000 miles or more. I told him to just ride it and enjoy.

He calls me that weekend saying it was running really badly and could I come over and see what was wrong with it. It was one of those dreaded moments where you think that some issue, unknown to you, had cropped up with the new owner. He then figuring I knew about some defect all along. Wouldn't blame him.

I get to his house and was escorted to the garage where the bike sat looking as good as ever. I asked him to start it up and it made the worst clattering, metal eating metal sound I'd ever heard from an engine. 'Shut it off!', I said immediately. I pulled the tank off to see what I could see and looking at the valve cover I noticed one of the valve adjustment access caps was brand new. These were round caps located just above each valve and sealed by an O-Ring. 4 along the front and 4 along the back.

I asked him why there was a new cap. He said he'd broken one. The only way this was possible, other than just hitting it with a hammer to smash it, was to tighten it to the point where it shattered. You never want to tighten an O-Ring sealed component more than snug. He must have really cranked down hard on that cap. I asked him why he was messing with it at all. He said he wanted to adjust the valves. I reminded him that I'd just done that and he said he just wanted to do it himself.

Abandoning that line of thought I asked him where the shattered parts from the original cap were. He said he tried to retrieve them trough the hole with a magnet. But that didn't work. (DUH! It's Aluminum!) An obvious fact which I didn't bother to mention.

"So," he says, "I just bought a new cap and put it on. I figured it would be OK."

I told him that those broken parts were destroying the engine and not to even crank it over at all until he corrects the problem. That the valve cover would have to come off and on that bike, you had to pull the engine to get the valve cover off. He wanted to work on his new bike, and he definitely accomplished that need.

I never heard from him again. I have a feeling that he sent that perfectly good machine to the motorcycle graveyard. That really hurt. Needless to say, I regretted selling that bike to him.

This is just another example of ....... there is NO cure for STUPID .....consider yourself lucky He never contacted you again ...... Mike

[hersch]

I hope everything works out great!! It's a shame, but you should have a goodun when it's all said and done!

[Peder]

When Can Am put the new ACE engine in the RT, my dealer had a customer come in and purchase one. The customer lived about 180 miles from the dealership. He drove it home and had no issues. A couple of days later he called the dealership and said he did not think the cooling fans were working because he could not hear them. His previous ride was an older RT with the V twin engine and when those fans cycled on, he could hear them. The mechanic told him that his new RT was a lot different than his old one. One of the things that changed was the configuration of the cooling fans. They had been changed so they would make less noise. The mechanic also asked the customer if the bike was over heating and the customer said no, but he was convinced that the fans were not working. The mechanic told the customer to bring the bike in and he would take a look at it. When the bike arrived, the mechanic ran tests on the temp sensor and the fans and could not find anything wrong, everything was working as they should. The customer was not happy but took the bike back home anyway. A few weeks later the customer calls again and is now positive that the fans are not working even though the engine is not over heating. He was told to bring the bike in, and the mechanic would have another look at it. Again, the mechanic could find nothing wrong and showed the customer that the fans do work as they should. The mechanic told the customer again that the cooling fans on his new RT are much quieter than the fans on his old RT. The customer left displeased again. A month or so later the customer called and said the engine had blown up and that he was positive that the cooling fans were the cause. He brought the bike back to the dealer and the mechanic discovered that the fans were the problem. The customer was so convinced that the fans were not working that he eliminated the temp sensor and installed a switch so he could turn the fans on and off. Although the customer never admitted it, everyone at the dealership believed that he forgot to turn the fans on and the engine overheated. Because the bike was still under warranty, the dealership called corporate to find out if they would cover the cost of a new engine. Can Am told the dealer to give the customer a new bike, pull the engine out of the old bike and send it back to Can Am. Can Am sent them a new engine to install in the old bike. The customer got a new bike and was told not to set foot in that dealership again. I have a friend that purchased the old bike with the new engine and enjoyed riding it many thousands of miles with no problems. Oh, the mechanic that worked on the bike was Shawn Smoak.

[BajaRon]

When Can Am put the new ACE engine in the RT, my dealer had a customer come in and purchase one. The customer lived about 180 miles from the dealership. He drove it home and had no issues. A couple of days later he called the dealership and said he did not think the cooling fans were working because he could not hear them. His previous ride was an older RT with the V twin engine and when those fans cycled on, he could hear them. The mechanic told him that his new RT was a lot different than his old one. One of the things that changed was the configuration of the cooling fans. They had been changed so they would make less noise. The mechanic also asked the customer if the bike was over heating and the customer said no, but he was convinced that the fans were not working. The mechanic told the customer to bring the bike in and he would take a look at it. When the bike arrived, the mechanic ran tests on the temp sensor and the fans and could not find anything wrong, everything was working as they should. The customer was not happy but took the bike back home anyway. A few weeks later the customer calls again and is now positive that the fans are not working even though the engine is not over heating. He was told to bring the bike in, and the mechanic would have another look at it. Again, the mechanic could find nothing wrong and showed the customer that the fans do work as they should. The mechanic told the customer again that the cooling fans on his new RT are much quieter than the fans on his old RT. The customer left displeased again. A month or so later the customer called and said the engine had blown up and that he was positive that the cooling fans were the cause. He brought the bike back to the dealer and the mechanic discovered that the fans were the problem. The customer was so convinced that the fans were not working that he eliminated the temp sensor and installed a switch so he could turn the fans on and off. Although the customer never admitted it, everyone at the dealership believed that he forgot to turn the fans on and the engine overheated. Because the bike was still under warranty, the dealership called corporate to find out if they would cover the cost of a new engine. Can Am told the dealer to give the customer a new bike, pull the engine out of the old bike and send it back to Can Am. Can Am sent them a new engine to install in the old bike. The customer got a new bike and was told not to set foot in that dealership again. I have a friend that purchas3.ed the old bike with the new engine and enjoyed riding it many thousands of miles with no problems. Oh, the mechanic that worked on the bike was Shawn Smoak.

Be interesting to know if he'd ever owned a used 750 Honda that he worked on back in his younger days!

Why would you disconnect the automatic fan trigger system? If you want them switched, just add a bypass circuit. Then, if you forget, you still have the factory system backing you up. That guy was lucky. BRP shouldn't have given him anything at all.

[Peter Aawen]

Be interesting to know if he'd ever owned a used 750 Honda that he worked on back in his younger days!

Why would you disconnect the automatic fan trigger system? If you want them switched, just add a bypass circuit. Then, if you forget, you still have the factory system backing you up. That guy was lucky. BRP shouldn't have given him anything at all.

More than once I've had similar experiences to yours with that Honda, Ron!!

Those types really are out there, and despite all advice to the opposite, they seemingly just HAVE to fiddle with things they KNOW they really shouldn't touch for any reason; then apparently in response to some inexplicable and irresistible urge and despite all warnings to the contrary, they seem to expect YOU to sort out their stuff-ups cos you sold them a machine that was functioning perfectly BEFORE they did those things they were explicitly told not to do on pain of exactly what happened...

Mind you, I blame their parents ( ) for never saying "No!" and meaning it, with repercussions if they ignored the directive!

[Latrappe]

Hello Scott, would love to see pictures of the end product

[Scottncol]

Hello Scott, would love to see pictures of the end product

For sure!

[Scottncol]

I hope to get this back today or tomorrow with a full report.

[Latrappe]

I am for you Scott, I am so glad it is working out for you and hope you get plenty of good miles from it after all the anguish you have had. rock

[greer]

Hoping for the best, Scott!

Sarah

[Scottncol]

Hoping for the best, Scott!

Sarah

While the motor was out, they wanted to change over the gaskets (only $150) to make sure there is no oil leak problems. That will take a few days to get the parts in and a bit of time to get them changed over.

I am also having them do the Pennsylvania state inspection while it's there.

I will keep you posted.

Scott

[Scottncol]

While they were getting the new engine ready to install, they took off the intake from the original (old) engine and found particles and chunks of metal fragments imbedded into the plastic. Rather than attempting to clean it, they decided it would be best to replace it.

processed-BA4DA8FC-89F6-4D1D-96C6-EF111B24B3DF.jpg

[Mikey]

Wow, if we only had a slow-motion vid of that while it was happening, it would be like watching a Nascar race.

[TerryTheSpyderRyder]

I loved those old "single cammer" bikes. Easy to ride, easy to work on even if you had to pull the engine, which isn't hard. I owned 5 at different times and used to have baskets of parts, all of which I sold or donated when I moved from my old house in the late 90s. Needless to say, the bikes I owned plus the parts would be worth big bucks today.

The fans on the ACE rarely turn on, they don't have to since the cooling system is so much better than on the previous 998. Mine never goes above 4 segments on the temp gauge, even on hot days and the fans rarely ever switch on, maybe only after sitting in traffic awhile.

[TroubledJuan]

At least he owned up to causing the issues and didn't say you sold him a lemon and he wants his money back.

[BajaRon]

At least he owned up to causing the issues and didn't say you sold him a lemon and he wants his money back.

True, and that shows integrity. It's just a shame that such a simple error in approach cost him a motor. That was the aspect I was addressing. Yes, it was closing the barn door after the horses were gone. But his misfortune might save someone else the grief.

[Scottncol]

The part is supposed to come in tomorrow and they said they would work on the bike until it is finished.

Let's hope!

[Scottncol]

Another delay. Part will not arrive until Friday.

Hopefully the bike is repaired early next week.

While waiting, I was able to acquire the other parts that were missing. (Mono seat cowl, frunk plastic bucket, service access panel).

So, when it is completed at the dealer, I will have a full bike.

[greer]

Dang it. Hang in there Scott, and thanks for the update. Great job gathering up the odds and ends, too.

Sarah

[Scottncol]

Well, just got the call that they are wrapping up the bike.

As long as there are no additional issues, I can pick it up on Saturday. (Possibly Friday).

[old Timer]

We definitely want pictures....... Notice that what I said was plural, as in many.

[Scottncol]

It’s back!!!

It purrs like a kitten! Pictures and videos tomorrow.

[hersch]

Fantastic!! Looking forward to pics and vid's.