Serious errors P0123, P2135, P284E, P2806. Please help

[Wmoater]

Spyder battery somehow died. When charged headlights don’t turn off ever. Now fault codes P0123, P2135, P284E, P2806 and in limp mode. Will turn on and off fine. 30 seconds after turning off dash turns off and all lights turn off but headlight. What do these codes mean. I was replacing airbag and was fine before I put up on lift.

[Wmoater]

After reading a few posts I am getting an E where it says 1. It is allowing me to shift into 1 and R but nothing else.

[BertRemington]

First question: did you disconnect the ACS height sensor before lifting the Spyder to replace the airbag?

Second question: have you reconnected the rear shock?

Third question: is the Spyder sitting on the ground away from the lift?

Four question: have you fully charged (at least overnight) the battery with the negative lead disconnected?

If the answers to those questions aren't all Yes we need to get to Yes before proceeding with diagnosis.

[Wmoater]

Question 1- yes removed 10mm bottom arm bolt. Need to hold because it freespun inside. That is back on tight
Question 2- not tightened but bolts are through. Wanted to sit on spyder put into first gear to activate compressor to see if compressor turned on and it has and airbag filled.
Question 3- spyder is on ground. Never spun the wheel off ground. I have put old battery in and just actually drove it. The there is a loud click as I shift. When I let off the throttle I now hear what sounds like a ziptie or card in the spokes of wheel sound but coming from inside motors. Only when letting off throttle do I hear that sound. After reving a few times it did go into drive and I went through all 6 gears on the road. Thought maybe that would clear it. All plastic is still off though so it does sound louder. No problems shifting but there is a distinct click when shifting. It is saying limp mode but no problem getting up to speed accept when starting into 1st it’s sluggish. Headlight still staying on. E has gone away. Next step disconnect pedal commander maybe.
Question 4 no but using old battery and it is recording 13.8 when motor off so it’s good. I removed new battery and replaced with old. So not sure how to answer.

I

[Wmoater]

Looking at some of these codes they pertain to manual SE5 SERIES. mines the 1330 auto. Codes seem to do with throttle, clutch and shifter switch but can’t tell from reading. They are all pre 2013 stuff.

[BertRemington]

WRT disconnecting the Pedal Commander. Code P0123 points in that direction per service manual:

P0123

ECM

First Throttle Accelerator Sensor (TAS) shorted to battery +

Damaged circuit wires, damaged throttle position sensor or damaged ECM pins.

Make sure sensor connector is fully inserted. Measure resistance from connector: ECMB-K1 to TAS-A (expected value: < 2 ohms). Measure resistance from connector: ECMB-K3 to TAS-B (expected value: < 2 ohms). Measure resistance from connector: ECMB-E1 to TAS-C (expected value: < 2 ohms)

[BertRemington]

Your problems started here

Strange thing going on. I have my spyder up on lift. It was working and started just fine 2 days ago. Installed new airbag. Wanted to test everything before I reinstall shock. Turned spyder on to start and it’s dead. Checked connection real quick all good. Checked volts and it’s dead. Must have left something on to kill it.

What could that something be? I can't think of anything but leaving the ignition on. Did you do that?

[Snowbelt Spyder]

Looking at some of these codes they pertain to manual SE5 SERIES. mines the 1330 auto. Codes seem to do with throttle, clutch and shifter switch but can’t tell from reading. They are all pre 2013 stuff.

Why do you think that? Right out of the BUDS2 database for a 2017...

P0123 - First Throttle Accelerator Sensor shorted to battery +. Damaged wires, ECM pins or damaged TAS sensor.

P2135 - TAS plausibility check error between sensor 1 and 2.

P284E - Unintended upshift detected. Hydraulic pressure without current to the shift solenoid or Linkage problem.

P2806 - GBPS ground wire damaged or open. Damaged wires, ECM pins, sensor or transmission.

Headlights will stay on at all times if the headlamp relay is stuck. I think it's R2 in the RFB. I don't have an exact diagram for a 2017 RT, but one pretty close. Don't know why charging has anything to do with it without being there. How do you hook up? I have no idea if some of these are red herrings caused by the battery situation. But I sure would remove the pedal commander.

[BertRemington]

SS -- concur with this

Headlights will stay on at all times if the headlamp relay is stuck. I think it's R2 in the RFB. I don't have an exact diagram for a 2017 RT, but one pretty close. I have no idea if some of these are red herrings caused by the battery situation. But I sure would remove the pedal commander.

Yes the headlights will stay on due to stuck relay but the instrument console controls that relay. I think the relay is good but something is broken in the electronic not electric modules. This is deeply troubling

After reving a few times it did go into drive and I went through all 6 gears on the road.

which relates to your P284E code description because it points at possible TCM/HCM failure.

[Wmoater]

#1 sorry guys had to go pick up wife and run around a bit. Ok so first thing to do I apologize I Said pedal commander it’s the pedal box. Shouldn’t make a difference both connect at same location so step one disconnect pedal box connection and connect back to original. Remove pedal box all together.

#2 find the headlight relay and pull that. Then reinsert see if it resets.

Will do those and report back.

But what caused all this instantly? My guess is the battery is dead because I didn’t catch that the headlights didn’t turn off and walked out. Lights stay on for 30 seconds or so and I probably just walked out not paying attention. How could that draw down and react with pedal box? Or was it when I tried to start it and it surged?

[Wmoater]

Your problems started here What could that something be? I can't think of anything but leaving the ignition on. Did you do that?

Could have. My usb power port does have a power plug and might have been turned on. I have it direct wire right now.

[BertRemington]

I've got some scenarios and none end well.

Lift points are kinda touchy for the Spyder since, like a motorcycle, you have to lift the center backbone. There is the possibility if a jack was used together with some wood spacers, there was contact outside of the backbone if the Spyder was rocked back and forth sideways. On the right is the HCM pressure transducer and on the left is the shift solenoid.

Since the SE6 clutch is pressure engaged, the HCM needs correct pressure measurements which the transducer provides. Damage to the transducer could interfere with measurement accuracy.

The SE6 automatically shifts down as speed slows when braking. If the shift mechanism is misaligned, repeated automatic attempts to downshift may be the source of the buzzing on deceleration.

And embarrassingly I remembered another source of battery drainage with ignition key off -- brake pedal pushed down. Happened to me when I was doing circuit and function testing. When my neighbor knocked on my door at 10pm and asked what was the red glow under the Spyder cover I immediately remembered I had forgotten to remove the brick (literally) from the brake pedal. But I'm thinking this isn't what happened here.

If the USB adapter hasn't caused a problem before it's probably not the cause this time.

[Wmoater]

My wife is pretty sure the headlights were locked on a couple days ago. She thought she saw a glow coming out of the garage 2 nights ago but didn’t really think anything of it. That would have been 4 hours or so after shutting it off, so they would have been dim. So, if solenoid was stuck, which it very well could be, then the headlights killed the battery. I am first going to try to pull it and reinsert and see what happens and then swap and see what happened. Last week, I did do some really good cleaning while the plastic was all off, but I didn’t spray anything directly. Just wipe and clean. I'll start with lights and pedal box first. If it's attached & jump started it’s the 1000 model Noco, I wonder if a surge would have welded pedal box pins?

[Wmoater]

This makes NO sense! I pulled the headlight relay. Headlight went out. Cleaned it and inserted and it came on again. Bad relay? So I pulled fog light relay and push it into headlight. Light comes on again. Can't be relay? So I pull the relay, light goes out. Start Spyder, thought let it shut down correctly and might reset. Guess what......all the darn codes gone, all ticking gone, throttle perfect and check engine light gone. The lump error gone. Shut it down and listen for relay to kick off. Dash etc go out and I plug relay back in. Light comes back on. Start Spyder and all errors, ticking, throttle all back! So I remove relay and unplug pedal box and no errors. Throttle Skippy, limp everything gone. Now plug in relay with no pedal box and all the errors back. What the heck is going on. With headlight relay out it shifts perfect up and down, no sound, nothing. Relay in and all errors, bad ticking, bad throttle. How can headlights be messing other systems up?

[BertRemington]

The innate animosity of inanimate objects.

Your next best friends will be a service manual, a small bright LED flashlight and a DVOM.

[Woodaddict]

did the airbag pump electrical wires get pinched by anything??

[Bfromla]

Double check gremlin bell. Sounds quite annoying indeed, sorry. Thanks for sharing processes

[Mikey]

This makes NO sense! I pulled the headlight relay. Headlight went out. Cleaned it and inserted and it came on again. Bad relay? So I pulled fog light relay and push it into headlight. Light comes on again. Can't be relay? So I pull the relay, light goes out. Start Spyder, thought let it shut down correctly and might reset. Guess what......all the darn codes gone, all ticking gone, throttle perfect and check engine light gone. The lump error gone. Shut it down and listen for relay to kick off. Dash etc go out and I plug relay back in. Light comes back on. Start Spyder and all errors, ticking, throttle all back! So I remove relay and unplug pedal box and no errors. Throttle Skippy, limp everything gone. Now plug in relay with no pedal box and all the errors back. What the heck is going on. With headlight relay out it shifts perfect up and down, no sound, nothing. Relay in and all errors, bad ticking, bad throttle. How can headlights be messing other systems up?

I would start by getting to new relays, getting some contact cleaner and a small pick and clean the plugs that the relays go into, put a dab of dielectric grease on the pins and snap the new relays in and see what happens. Relays are cheap and gremlins suck, and you have to start somewhere, because you have gremlins.

[CloverHillCrawler]

I would start by getting to new relays, getting some contact cleaner and a small pick and clean the plugs that the relays go into, put a dab of dielectric grease on the pins and snap the new relays in and see what happens. Relays are cheap and gremlins suck, and you have to start somewhere, because you have gremlins.

After you replace the relays and if it is still there I would start looking at the wires/connections feeding that relay, As I was pointing out in your other thread about this it sounds like you have something either reversed or shorted that is backfeeding into the circuit.

It sounds like you have it narrowed down to the circuit, now to find where the damage/bad connection is at on that circuit. I would start with the wires that have the current that control the relay since the light comes on when the relay is in place means you are getting voltage that is closing that relay. If voltage was coming into the headlights past the relay then they would be on all of the time.

You could also have a short in a piece of equipment that is backfeeding the ground which is causing multiple errors. I would closely inspect around the areas you were working in/on/touched or lifted from for any damage to the wiring or electrical connectors.

[BertRemington]

Assuming 2017 wiring isn't too far from 2014 the service manual says:

Battery => RFB J4 (Always-On) => LFB R6 (N-C) => RFB R2 (N-O) => Lo Beam

R2 is controlled by ECM (not console like I said above).

So (1) something is telling your ECM the engine is running so it commands R2 closed or (2) R2 is stuck closed or (3) the headlight related wiring is damaged.

I'm going with (1).

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Wmoater, I think your trouble comes from left handlebar switch. The main headlight relay is activated by the ground side of the main headlight relay coil being taken to ground by the processor board in the MSL. If the processor board in the MSL has crapped out or been damaged in some fashion or other it's conceivable it would cause all those other errors. The shift signal comes from that board, as does also the cruise control signal from the right handlebar switch cluster. Take the left switch cluster apart an see what you find. It may not be anything more than water or cleaning agent got onto it when you cleaned everything.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

R2 is controlled by ECM (not console like I said above).

By way of the MSL processor board, not by direct connection to the ECM.

Actually, to be more accurate the relay is controlled by the MSL board which is controlled by CAN Bus signals from the ECM.

[BertRemington]

Based on what Idaho described my 2014 wiring is apparently different from the 2017 so ignore my circuit description.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Based on what Idaho described my 2014 wiring is apparently different from the 2017 so ignore my circuit description.

Interesting! I'm also looking at the 2014 RT wiring diagram!

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

My bad. It's the CC signal from the MSR that comes to the MSL, not the throttle signal.