DPS Problems, We Can No Longer Ignore "The Elephant In The Living Room"

[Magic Man]

As you all know I LOVE our Spyder's and I even have a new RT and trailer on order. I have been, and continue to be a loyal BRP customer and supporter. I continually showing that support not only with my words, but with my hard earned money as well.

I as well as NMN also have a vested interest in seeing the Spyder's do well and continue to grow market share.

BUT.....

I think we and BRP can no longer "ignore the elephant in the living room" when it comes to the Spyder having too many, and some "real problems" with the DPS system on this bike.

There are now just too many people we know about (and many I'm sure don't even know what a "forum" is) who have had some sort of "real issue" with the power steering on their Spyder to continue just say it is just the "luck of the draw" and failures do happen sometimes.

I myself had one of the Spyder's that was delivered to me with a totally non-functioning power steering unit, which gave me no warning codes and no "heads up" that there was something wrong until I could do my own "side by side" test with our SE5 in Sept. of last year.

It was then I saw just how bad our SM5 really was. Thankfully, it caused no operation problems with my Spyder in the 10 months prior. But, it still is not a good feeling knowing that a major system like the DPS was delivered to me by the dealer totally non-functioning! That it required me to be able to do my "own diagnosis" that there was a problem. This on a machine that is touted to have all these wonderful "self check programs" and even a "limp home" safety mode. It won't let me ride with a burned out brake light, but let me drive around for 10 months with a non-functioning DPS unit?

Again, this week there was another potential buyer posting here about how it is becoming "known" that the Spyder is having too many problems for many people to want to risk "their limited riding time" and their "hard earned money' buying one. With most of these concerns centering around the DPS, and shifting problems.

I was there this past week and saw first hand the failure Lamonster's Spyder had when his DPS died in Daytona. Although he said "it was not too bad at highway speeds" the effort it took to steer his bike when I sat on it was down right freighting!

I think now with so many people having had, and reporting problems both before and after the update, that something is just not right here. GOD FORBID that someone gets hurt on one now! Hopefully this won't happen, but if it does there are now just too many "verified cases" of steering system problems for BRP to be able to dodge a HUGE liability lawsuit. There have just been too many "verified problems" with the steering on this bike to continue to ignore that it really could be BRP's fault if someone gets hurt from this point forward.

I know as a product manufacturer, that even "rumors" regarding "safety issues" can rune a products image and salability. Unfortunately I think that is now starting to happen to the Spyder's as these 'rumors" are starting to seep into the mainstream buyers mind in the market, and we are now seeing it effect their buying decisions.

Like I said, hopefully no one will pay the ultimate price and have a failure cause them to get hurt, costing BRP many dollars with lawsuits and such. However, I think the potential loss in sales and product image could be costing BRP more than that already?

I think it is time some "real hard questions" are both asked of, and answered by BRP regarding the short comings in the DPS system on these bikes.

Thankfully, most of the failures have been more along the lines like mine was and only be owner annoyances, and not caused most people any harm. But, I think if they keep "ignoring the elephant in the living room" sooner or later it is going to cause a real problem.

My fear is that just like most things involving something as big an "elephant" when it happens, it will indeed be HUGE problem.

MM

[rnet]

Perhaps the answer is to do away with the onboard computors and go back to the one sitting on top of your neck.

[dave01]

Great post. I have been wondering myself how long and how bad the power steering issue would have to get before BRP devotes more time and effort into solving the problem. I have only had a few instances where the steering acted up, one from a loose relay due to me hitting a rather large pothole ( gotta remember the wheel in the middle) and 2 times, once while coming back from Orlando last week and yesterday while crossing the bay. Mine are rather uneventful ( thank God), more like no power assist than the forced turning that others have had . Thanks MM for the post.

[fastfraser]

Well said Magicman. We need someone that is well respected on this forum to bring this to the forefront (Not that it isn't already on everyones mind already ) I love my and since May have clocked a tad over 10,000 miles on it with a few problems (new front tires at 6,000 miles not under warranty )

I continue to enjoy it ,but in the back off my mind i wonder how dependable it really is with all these issues being posted ? And how many recalls are in our future ?

I have a lot invested in my ( 30 plus K ) and was seriously thinking to trade-up to a RTS regardless of the loss i would take on trade or resale but now will wait a few years until they work the bugs out.

I will continue to ride and enjoy my !! Although a little more cautiously and a little more doubt as to its reliability.

[docdoru]

I feel like a subject in the clinical trial: one may choose to participate in the trial know that they are volunteering for a research project, the purpose of the research, the methods to be used, and the risks and possible benefits of participating.

[fastfraser]

I hope NMN will still make top notch accessories for the regardless of the outcome.

[Magic Man]

Now my main worry has been if I or someone gets hurt as people are way more important than things any day.

However you bring up a very good point.

How happy are people going to be when their DPS goes out on one of these early Spyders now turning 2 years old this month?

I know a HUGE repair bill for a DPS repair on a system that has been shown to all along have some hidden bugs is NOT going to win over many hearts and minds of people for sure.

MM

[NancysToy]

Well expressed, Evan. Thank you for a straight-forward, unemotional post, complete with first hand experiences. Like you, I believe there is, indeed an elephant in the room. It has not and will not affect my use of the Spyder, and hasn't as yet affected my decision to order an RT. My biggest fear is that the problem(s), the solution(s), or the rumor and furor alone will spell the end for the Spyder platform...and possibly even for part of BRP. I'm sure they are paying attention, but it would be more comforting to those of us outside of the factory walls to hear from them that they are actively looking into it.

[nudle]

[Putt-Putt]

Very Good Magic man. Now that the 2 yr warrenty is almost up on the first ones. And we have continuing problems is BRP going to stand behind them or are we going to have to deal with it ourselves and out of our own pockets. When the warrenty is gone????

[Don in E Texas]

Let us not forget the bike fires that so far go without any fix outside of "after market devices" as a cause. I, for one, don't buy it. Issue is still out there waiting for the next chance to strike.

Surge problems. My bike was a hazard to ride after the "steering fix" was installed. Bike would cut off -- then on .....you had better be hanging on to ride the bike!!! Anyone that might be tailgating me might just run up my back tire it was running so poorly. The fix? Bypass the canister. This fix works, but not what should have happened. I still have the canister bypassed and the bike runs great.

Steering issues. Now we are getting scary out there folks!!!

Just glad BRP does not make airplanes..........(or submarines)

Ride safe, gang.

don

[Love2Ride]

So, what do we do? Start an online petition? Send it to BRP?

I don't want to come off alike some unhappy customer cuz it's just not true for me. I love my bike. I just want to be safe on it not at the mercy of a "code" issue. I ride with my 7 year old on back. So it's a MAJOR concern for me.

[j45p3r]

Let us not forget the bike fires that so far go without any fix outside of "after market devices" as a cause. I, for one, don't buy it. Issue is still out there waiting for the next chance to strike.

Surge problems. My bike was a hazard to ride after the "steering fix" was installed. Bike would cut off -- then on .....you had better be hanging on to ride the bike!!! Anyone that might be tailgating me might just run up my back tire it was running so poorly. The fix? Bypass the canister. This fix works, but not what should have happened. I still have the canister bypassed and the bike runs great.

Steering issues. Now we are getting scary out there folks!!!

Just glad BRP does not make airplanes..........

Ride safe, gang.

don

Just want to point out that they did fix the surging with the second update. And I rode on a Bombardier airplane last month

[BLACK WIDOW]

Well expressed, Evan. Thank you for a straight-forward, unemotional post, complete with first hand experiences. Like you, I believe there is, indeed an elephant in the room. It has not and will not affect my use of the Spyder, and hasn't as yet affected my decision to order an RT. My biggest fear is that the problem(s), the solution(s), or the rumor and furor alone will spell the end for the Spyder platform...and possibly even for part of BRP. I'm sure they are paying attention, but it would be more comforting to those of us outside of the factory walls to hear from them that they are actively looking into it.

Scotty you are correct. I think that one would have to have his head in the sand if he didn't notice all the problems (some very dangerous) with the Spyder. The best thing for BRP to do is quit playing the denial game and hit these issues head on and fix them. (or at least admit that there are problems with quality). This may be expensive, but would be a lot cheaper than settling lawsuits for years to come. I think that there is nothing wrong with the spyder that better quality control wouldn't fix. I ran Metrology laboratories for the Department of Defense (DOD) for years so I have been involved with quality issues and testing accuracies at a professional level and I can tell you that BRP needs to come out of the closet on this one. I have faith that they will.


Michael


Michael

[Magic Man]

Just glad BRP does not make airplanes..........(or submarines)

Ride safe, gang.

don

They do make airplanes!!!!!!!

As a matter of fact we were on one from Albany to NJ on our way to Daytona last week!

MM

[tatt2r]

Evan did Lamont get his fixed

[M2Wild]

Just glad BRP does not make airplanes..........(or submarines)

I think they do make planes and trains. Different division or branch of the same parent company.

Just want to point out that they did fix the surging with the second update. And I rode on a Bombardier airplane last month

So did the plane engine surge and gotten you there faster than usual?

[NewRider]

Unlike Black Widow, I do NOT have faith BRP will resolve to solve ongoing problems with our Spyders. Mine has run faultlessly so far...but I only have 1500 miles on it....yes, the growing cloud of suspicion has set in, and I'm truly sorry to say that.

[Degaman]

As one that has experienced the steering anomaly, it seems like a hardware problem (kinking at mid steer), and not something that can be corrected through a software update.

That being said, since the 'fix' to the 'fix', my machine is running better than it ever has. I will cross my fingers that the steering problem never resurfaces its ugly head.

[Putt-Putt]

Well expressed, Evan. Thank you for a straight-forward, unemotional post, complete with first hand experiences. Like you, I believe there is, indeed an elephant in the room. It has not and will not affect my use of the Spyder, and hasn't as yet affected my decision to order an RT. My biggest fear is that the problem(s), the solution(s), or the rumor and furor alone will spell the end for the Spyder platform...and possibly even for part of BRP. I'm sure they are paying attention, but it would be more comforting to those of us outside of the factory walls to hear from them that they are actively looking into it.

I sure would like to hear a statement from BRP on the subject. Straight forward and not all kinds of rhetoric.

[BLACK WIDOW]

Unlike Black Widow, I do NOT have faith BRP will resolve to solve ongoing problems with our Spyders. Mine has run faultlessly so far...but I only have 1500 miles on it....yes, the growing cloud of suspicion has set in, and I'm truly sorry to say that.

I have not had any real problems with my Spyder either with almost 7000 miles but 7000 miles isn't many miles and BRP needs to address the issues that many are having. If they would do this before things get out of hand they would restore faith and creditability in the Spyder; that is slowly slipping away. I honestly think they will do this; If they don't i'm afraid we may all own a collectors item. I certainly hope not!!

Michael

[Bulldogger]

Two questions is the steering electronic, and if it is, is it motor failures or electronic board failures

[Magic Man]

Evan did Lamont get his fixed

Not yet. He has talked to them but not had a chance to get it in to the dealer yet.

MM

[Magic Man]

Two questions is the steering electronic, and if it is, is it motor failures or electronic board failures

It is electronic.

It is a sealed non "in the feild serveced unit" and BRP has not said what the cause of failed units has been so far.

MM

[BRPjunkie]

I think they do make planes and trains. Different division or branch of the same parent company.


So did the plane engine surge and gotten you there faster than usual?

BRP was spun off from Bombardier several years ago and they no longer make airplanes or are affiliated with that company. BRP is strictly recreational products now.