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Thread: Canisterectomy

  1. #1
    Senior Member Latemarch's Avatar
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    Default Canisterectomy



    After all the fire reports, some associated with the strong smell of gas.
    And after coming back from a 100 mi. ride and parking the Spyder and then walking back into the garage an hour later to the very strong smell of gas. I was worried.
    I concluded that there were only two sources of gas vapors.
    Either a bad gas cap of a bad evap canister.
    Since my gas cap was working well I figured the evap canister had to go.

    The canister is easily removed by clipping the zip tie and lifting slightly and pulling it away from the bracket. Clip the Oetiker clamps that hold the hoses to the canister and remove canister.

    Vent hose from the gas tank was then clamped to an inline fuel filter and 24" of 1/4" fuel line clamped to the other end and run down, forward and out the inboard splash pan hole behind the radiator. The fuel filter is to prevent the sucking up of dust or junk into the tank when the tank cools.

    The purge line that leads into the purge solinoid was plugged with a bolt and clamped.

    If you needed to undo this for an emissions inspection it could be done in about 10min as nothing permanent has been done that can't be undone.
    A member of the rabble in good standing.
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  2. #2
    SpyderLovers Founder Lamonster's Avatar
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    That eliminates one potential problem.

  3. #3
    Ride Forrest Ride! effgjamis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latemarch View Post


    After all the fire reports, some associated with the strong smell of gas.
    And after coming back from a 100 mi. ride and parking the Spyder and then walking back into the garage an hour later to the very strong smell of gas. I was worried.
    I concluded that there were only two sources of gas vapors.
    Either a bad gas cap of a bad evap canister.
    Since my gas cap was working well I figured the evap canister had to go.

    The canister is easily removed by clipping the zip tie and lifting slightly and pulling it away from the bracket. Clip the Oetiker clamps that hold the hoses to the canister and remove canister.

    Vent hose from the gas tank was then clamped to an inline fuel filter and 24" of 1/4" fuel line clamped to the other end and run down, forward and out the inboard splash pan hole behind the radiator. The fuel filter is to prevent the sucking up of dust or junk into the tank when the tank cools.

    The purge line that leads into the purge solinoid was plugged with a bolt and clamped.

    If you needed to undo this for an emissions inspection it could be done in about 10min as nothing permanent has been done that can't be undone.
    After another ride or two, how about a report as to the smell, still there or gone?
    thanks
    Original FL XPRESS 5
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    Senior Member Latemarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by effgjamis View Post
    After another ride or two, how about a report as to the smell, still there or gone?
    thanks
    Unlike some Spyder owners, mine had never had the gas smell before. This was a first time for me.

    The canister reeks and is sitting outside! The Spyder doesn't anymore.
    Will be riding either later today or tomorrow......depends on how work goes.
    A member of the rabble in good standing.
    A happy owner of a yellow SE-5.
    NMN Risers, Mudflap Lights, Fender Tips, Center Brake Light w/ Triple Play, Throttlemeister, Madstad Robo-brackets, Madstad windshield, CHAD windshield, Canisterectomy, Exhaust wrap.

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    Very Active Member Firefly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latemarch View Post

    After all the fire reports, some associated with the strong smell of gas.
    And after coming back from a 100 mi. ride and parking the Spyder and then walking back into the garage an hour later to the very strong smell of gas. I was worried.
    I concluded that there were only two sources of gas vapors.
    Either a bad gas cap of a bad evap canister.
    Since my gas cap was working well I figured the evap canister had to go.

    The canister is easily removed by clipping the zip tie and lifting slightly and pulling it away from the bracket. Clip the Oetiker clamps that hold the hoses to the canister and remove canister.

    Vent hose from the gas tank was then clamped to an inline fuel filter and 24" of 1/4" fuel line clamped to the other end and run down, forward and out the inboard splash pan hole behind the radiator. The fuel filter is to prevent the sucking up of dust or junk into the tank when the tank cools.

    The purge line that leads into the purge solinoid was plugged with a bolt and clamped.

    If you needed to undo this for an emissions inspection it could be done in about 10min as nothing permanent has been done that can't be undone.

    I'm liking this idea---- but I'm confused---- what did you do with the line that comes from the engine? Sounds like you plugged it? Isn't that a vent line also? Is that what you are calling a Purge Line--- if so--- what does it do? I thought it was an overflow??

  6. #6
    Senior Member Latemarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly View Post
    I'm liking this idea---- but I'm confused---- what did you do with the line that comes from the engine? Sounds like you plugged it? Isn't that a vent line also? Is that what you are calling a Purge Line--- if so--- what does it do? I thought it was an overflow??
    The line from the engine arrives at a solinoid and from there plugs into the canister. I removed it from the canister and plugged it, leaving the solinoid where I found it. That's the bolt head you see there hanging down in the middle of the picture.

    The solinoid is, I think, called a purge solinoid. It activates when you start the engine and allows the vacume from the throttle bodies (that's where the engine line goes to) to draw out accumulated gas fumes from the canister so that it's ready to suck up new fumes when you turn the engine off.
    A member of the rabble in good standing.
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    Very Active Member Firefly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latemarch View Post
    The line from the engine arrives at a solinoid and from there plugs into the canister. I removed it from the canister and plugged it, leaving the solinoid where I found it. That's the bolt head you see there hanging down in the middle of the picture.

    The solinoid is, I think, called a purge solinoid. It activates when you start the engine and allows the vacume from the throttle bodies (that's where the engine line goes to) to draw out accumulated gas fumes from the canister so that it's ready to suck up new fumes when you turn the engine off.
    Interesting. So the solenoid is activated during startup and shutdown? Wonder if the solenoid could have a problem --- sparking and igniting the fumes. I want to confirm the purpose of that plugged line--- anyone know more about these?

    I'm liking your idea as the gas smell is annoying. Please post back your findings after you ride some more.

    Nice job!

  8. #8
    Senior Member Some Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly View Post

    Nice job!

    Number One: 2008 Yellow GS SM5. I love my Spyder.
    Number Two: 2012 RT-S Limited (the poop colored RT) I still have Number One, but Some Girl made me buy Number Two...

  9. #9
    BillGargan
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    No gas smells on my Spyder . . .

    But, in the event that I ever do, is the issue that this canister is busted and leaking. What is causing the fumes to show up.

    Sounds like an explosion hazard to me!

  10. #10
    Active Member Pilo's Avatar
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    Hey Latemarch, I got the same nasty gas odor. I am trying to fix or replace my gas cap (it cannot be tightened enough, as it starts ratcheting without completely sealing the opening), and may be I'll also remove the canister.

    Please let us know if your fumes problem has been solved, and how your Spyder behaves in terms of tuning and gas consumption without the can.

    My new SE5 consumes way too much gas, and I suspect that it sloshes out and / or evaporates thru the gas cap. Will also modify tire pressure and see if it improves.

    Saludos from an Argentinean in Venezuela


    Quote Originally Posted by Latemarch View Post
    The line from the engine arrives at a solinoid and from there plugs into the canister. I removed it from the canister and plugged it, leaving the solinoid where I found it. That's the bolt head you see there hanging down in the middle of the picture.

    The solinoid is, I think, called a purge solinoid. It activates when you start the engine and allows the vacume from the throttle bodies (that's where the engine line goes to) to draw out accumulated gas fumes from the canister so that it's ready to suck up new fumes when you turn the engine off.
    Quote Originally Posted by Latemarch View Post
    Unlike some Spyder owners, mine had never had the gas smell before. This was a first time for me.

    The canister reeks and is sitting outside! The Spyder doesn't anymore.
    Will be riding either later today or tomorrow......depends on how work goes.
    "Limitations only exist in the mind..."


  11. #11
    Senior Member Dragonrider's Avatar
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    Doing a cannisterectomy is common on BMW's too. On my $$22K LT, if you overfill the tank, the gas goes into the cannister - then the start-up vacuum collapses the gas tank. Since the Spyder's tank is metal, I don't see that as a problem, but venting sure is.

    We have those stupid filler collars here, and I'll bet a beer that they cause a squrit of gas into the cannister on every fill up.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Latemarch's Avatar
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    After my ride today. I noticed.....








    Nothing.
    No change in performance.
    No error codes.
    And best of all..........No smell.
    A member of the rabble in good standing.
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    Senior Member SpyderRyder810's Avatar
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    After my ride today. I noticed.....

    Nothing.
    No change in performance.
    No error codes.
    And best of all..........No smell.
    Thank you for the update...we're seriously considering this option.

    Joan is a Happy 'Premier Edition SM5' Spyder Owner

  14. #14
    Senile Member M2Wild's Avatar
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    And put Lamont's new oil catch can where the canister used to be.
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    Very Active Member Firefly's Avatar
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    The more I think about this - the more I really like the idea---- time to go buy some parts and do it!


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    SpyderLovers Sponsor BajaRon's Avatar
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    I really like this concept. Though I've had no issues and a very rare, faint smell of fuel (and I pump my tank as full as it will go, every time) I am going to do this or something very similar.

    Great idea!
    Only SLOW people have to leave on time...



  17. #17
    Very Active Member Firefly's Avatar
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    I'm torn between doing this and being safe and not-smelly--- and keeping it stock in case I ever had a fire. Seems BRP is trying to blame user-mods for these fires.

    Then again- I've done so many mods--- if the evap can causes a fire-- they might try to blame one of my mods--- like the garage door opener---

    Does anyone know what the service life of the evap can is?

  18. #18
    SpyderLovers Sponsor BajaRon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly View Post
    I'm torn between doing this and being safe and not-smelly--- and keeping it stock in case I ever had a fire. Seems BRP is trying to blame user-mods for these fires.

    Then again- I've done so many mods--- if the evap can causes a fire-- they might try to blame one of my mods--- like the garage door opener---

    Does anyone know what the service life of the evap can is?
    Service life of an evap can is essentially forever. There isn't anything to really wear out and I don't know anyone that has ever replaced one other than for physical damage.
    Only SLOW people have to leave on time...



  19. #19
    Senile Member M2Wild's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BajaRon View Post
    Service life of an evap can is essentially forever. There isn't anything to really wear out and I don't know anyone that has ever replaced one other than for physical damage.
    One time I over filled my RX300 and it started to drip gas under the car. I thought the tank was rusted thru but it turned out that the evap can was full because I over filled the tank. I spend a $100 bucks for them to tell me that I need to spend $700 more for them to replace my evap can (because I could fail emission and once the can is filled with gas its no longer useful). I just laughed at them and walked out of there.
    Silver SM5 PE# 1274, Hindle Exhaust, Touring Windshield, Caliper Trim, B.E.S.T. 3 Year Ext, Nuvi 255 GPS, Fog Lights, Sport Rack, Back Rest, 12V Outlet, Talon 3300p Alarm, NMN Mud Flap and TipZ LEDs, SpyderLovers Emblems, Kuryakyn Widow Pegs and Axel Trim, Luimoto seat skin, Evo Air Filter and O2 Mod, Cranker Tank Bag, Blue Sea fuse block, MAD/AMS/MBG, Oddyssey battery, IPS.

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  20. #20
    Senior Member Latemarch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BajaRon View Post
    Service life of an evap can is essentially forever. There isn't anything to really wear out and I don't know anyone that has ever replaced one other than for physical damage.
    This is true. Though once you get liquid gas in the canister it ceases to function as designed. Theoretically as you continue to pull air thru the canister via the purge valve and into the throttle body it should eventually clear the liquid and return to function. Unfortunately since we refill our tanks on a frequent basis new liquid tends to get in there and keeping it from functioning.

    My canister sat out in the sun for a day getting good and hot and it no longer smells much of gas. I'm guessing that I've probably evaporated the liquid out of it and if I put it back in it would probably function untill the next splash of liquid.

    One other thought, I don't think that evap canisters are required in every country. Are there any Spyder owners that don't have a canister that came with the Sypder? If so how is the tank vented?
    A member of the rabble in good standing.
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  21. #21
    Motorbike Professor NancysToy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Latemarch View Post
    This is true. Though once you get liquid gas in the canister it ceases to function as designed. Theoretically as you continue to pull air thru the canister via the purge valve and into the throttle body it should eventually clear the liquid and return to function. Unfortunately since we refill our tanks on a frequent basis new liquid tends to get in there and keeping it from functioning.

    My canister sat out in the sun for a day getting good and hot and it no longer smells much of gas. I'm guessing that I've probably evaporated the liquid out of it and if I put it back in it would probably function untill the next splash of liquid.

    One other thought, I don't think that evap canisters are required in every country. Are there any Spyder owners that don't have a canister that came with the Sypder? If so how is the tank vented?
    Actually, I believe the evap canisters contain activated charcoal, whose function would be completely used up by any spilled gas. That would render the canister ineffective from an emissions standpoint, even if no liquid gas remained.
    -Scotty
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  22. #22
    Senior Member Dragonrider's Avatar
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    I have all the tupperware off my Spyder to install some new farkles, and performed the canisterectomy last night. I found a metal fuel filter (Shuck's $1.99) and vented the line to the rear of the Spyder. I didn't want the fumes (or gas overflow) in front of either the cooling fan or exhaust.

    We have another triple digit front coming next week & I'll let you know if this does the job...

  23. #23
    Very Active Member Tom in NM's Avatar
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    Default I have written about this before . . . . .

    I am curious and maybe somebody can point me to where I can get more information.

    I HAD the heavy gas smell / vapor problem. Not just the odor of gasoline, but vapor strong enough to start a gag reflex. Also, when I would fill up the Spyder ( a new 2008 SE5 ) when the light came on, it would only take about 3.5 gallons, but the top bar and triangle never darkened. There would be at least one episode of gasoline vapors in every ride.

    All that stopped around 2,650 miles a couple of months ago. No gas vapors. It now takes 4.5 to 5+ gallons at fill-up when the light comes on. All the bars are dark on the indicator.

    In another posting, Scotty mentioned that it sounded like the Purge Valve could have been stuck and was now unstuck. I should have asked at the time, but since everything was fine, I didn't - but, where can I find out more on how the purge valve and evaporation canister work? I get the premise, but not the mechanics.

    This mod sounds like a solution that works and you cannot argue with success, but I would like to know more - just in case the problem comes back.

    Thanks

    Tom

  24. #24
    Senior Member krb1945's Avatar
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    Default You may be able to purge a...

    evap canister that has been flooded by and over filled tank. Put it under your outside shed and focus a shop spot light on it at a close range. This will keep it nice and warm for a few hours and all the gas will evaporate.
    Ken krb1945 "Happy Owner"
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  25. #25
    Senior Member Dragonrider's Avatar
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    We'll see what the future brings (100 degrees coming again) - but NO FUMES for the first time!!

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