Non ethanol in the spyder?

[Mikey]

If you ride your machine quite often, not a problem. If it sits for weeks at a time, use non-ethanol fuel, because it does absorb moisture from the ambient air, When we/I get back from a ride and know I will not be riding the machine for a time, I will top it off with non-ethanol fuel so hopefully I don't have any issues when I decide to start it up again. Just me being "anal" I guess. Mac

A lot of us in Maine put some sort of stabil in our gases for lawn mowers, ect, ect. I put some in my can every time I fill them so my gas is treated for the times I fill the tanks and have to let them sit for a while with out running them. Ever sense we were blessed with this e10 gas in Maine it has been a real blast. Stuff that was not set for it was breaking down and just not running right at all. A friend of mine that has a business in marine engine repair was working 18hr days fixing the issues of this crap. All I can say is Thank god for the state of California and all the help they give all of us saving our selves from ourselves. Did I say that out loud Devil made me do it!

[Mad Mac]

A lot of us in Maine put some sort of stabil in our gases for lawn mowers, ect, ect. I put some in my can every time I fill them so my gas is treated for the times I fill the tanks and have to let them sit for a while with out running them. Ever sense we were blessed with this e10 gas in Maine it has been a real blast. Stuff that was not set for it was breaking down and just not running right at all. A friend of mine that has a business in marine engine repair was working 18hr days fixing the issues of this crap. All I can say is Thank god for the state of California and all the help they give all of us saving our selves from ourselves. Did I say that out loud Devil made me do it!

I feel it made the corn farmers richer, jury's still out to whether we import less of the crude oil or not. I know that motors produced after 1990& something(memory is slipping) are designed to hold up better(rubber & plastic parts), but it still attracts moisture and if it attracts enough, you will have issues. I use Stabil in all my fuel cans that have any amount of fuel in them, just in case. My snow thrower has it in it during the summer and my Spyder is put up in the winter with a full tank of gas with it also. So far it has served me well and have not had any issues. Mac

[SilverFox1]

Be diligent guys and gals,,, there is two different types of Stabil. One for regular gas and another one for ethanol containing ⛽️ . Ah the heck with all this I’m moving to Alaska! LOL

SilverFox

[Buckeye Bleau]

I really hate this topic because of the topic.

i cannot figure out why the non-E fuel costs more than the E fuel when it has to be added to the gasoline. Yes, I am well aware of logistics in transportation and storage of higher volume product, thank you.

I use about an ounce of Startron Enzyme E treatment in every tank I buy for the Spyder. Supposedly it can handle the E10, OK, I like the insurance. I have seen what ethanol fuels can do to parts, and I don't want to deal with that on the Spyder.

As my friends from overseas ask me, "Why are you burning the food?" One of you put responsibility on farmers so that they could get rich from higher corn prices, you don't know what you are talking about. Prior to this fiasco corn prices were about $2 then they went to $4+ and yes it helped the farmers, but what you city folk don't know is that it cost more than $2 to grow, harvest and take the corn to market. Yes, now they can make a profit, woohoo!

The government used your money to subsidize the building of the E plants, they subsidize the manufacturing of it, all with your money. What we get is a more expensive product, with diminished performance to net a minuscule improvement in emissions. Again, the insanity of the thought that the government has the answer.

Joe

[BajaRon]

I really hate this topic because of the topic.

i cannot figure out why the non-E fuel costs more than the E fuel when it has to be added to the gasoline. Yes, I am well aware of logistics in transportation and storage of higher volume product, thank you.

I use about an ounce of Startron Enzyme E treatment in every tank I buy for the Spyder. Supposedly it can handle the E10, OK, I like the insurance. I have seen what ethanol fuels can do to parts, and I don't want to deal with that on the Spyder.

As my friends from overseas ask me, "Why are you burning the food?" One of you put responsibility on farmers so that they could get rich from higher corn prices, you don't know what you are talking about. Prior to this fiasco corn prices were about $2 then they went to $4+ and yes it helped the farmers, but what you city folk don't know is that it cost more than $2 to grow, harvest and take the corn to market. Yes, now they can make a profit, woohoo!

The government used your money to subsidize the building of the E plants, they subsidize the manufacturing of it, all with your money. What we get is a more expensive product, with diminished performance to net a minuscule improvement in emissions. Again, the insanity of the thought that the government has the answer.

Joe

"Government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem."

Ronald Reagan - January 20, 1981

[Motorcycledave]

Whenever I head to the airport with my friend
for a ride in his Cessna, which is often
I always fill my spider with aviation fuel
Big Fun

Does anyone put non ethanol in the spyder? Is it better for the spyder ?

[Wildrice]

Some what has more than 10% ??
I assume that you have proof of that claim.....(NOT).

The high octane rating of pure ethanol isn't much of a "bright spot" since is has significantly less energy content.
Some drag racers like it.
South America seems to like it.
Pretty much nobody else does.

I did read the PROOF sheet of several gas stations that were evaluated--I didn't keep the info--can't remember which of the 10 racing sites I saw it on.
For those of us who have melted the valve seat out of the aluminum head--octane does make a difference. I usually used C-16 = 117 Octane at $18/gal but several more budget non professional bike racers like myself do use E-85 at the track & they drain it after track use. Lighten up Easy Rider-- Google it.
Darrell

https://www.digitaltrends.com/cars/t...l-in-your-gas/

http://www.fuel-testers.com/ethanol_...dvantages.html

http://www.phaedrus.me/id142.html
"E10 gas sold in the U.S. may have up to 10% ethanol. It is however, not required to have 10% ethanol. The percentage of ethanol actually in the gas at the pump varies based on tax incentives, economics, seasonal environmental air pollution conditions, and other factors. The actual ethanol level contained in E10 gas delivered to a station is required to be noted on the invoice for the gasoline, although most attendants in gas stations will not have a clue about this or have access to this information. Since it was not possible for me to obtain the actual ethanol content of many of the gasoline test samples which I have collected, I can not state how accurate the following measurements are. However, the results of this testing are consistent with other measurements that I have made on other gas samples in Northern Virginia, and consistent with the information which I have been able to obtain from drivers of fuel delivery vehicles as they have refilled tanks in local fuel stations."

& with all the products made in the world from building supplies, medical equipment, even aerospace--from time to time everything I can't think of anything that hasn't had some marginal error in production, but a large quantity product like ethanol gasoline has never drifted from it's intended blend---hmmm--that's a tough sell to me.....
Darrell

[gnorthern]

I feel it made the corn farmers richer, jury's still out to whether we import less of the crude oil or not. Mac

As a firm believer in significant made caused climate change, driver of a hybrid, owner of solar panels and a super energy efficient house, I am probably much more of an environmentally concerned member than many in this forum. I think this ethanol stuff was a mistake.

btw - I kept records on my previous two motorcycles and they got way better gas mileage without ethanol.

[Mad Mac]

As a firm believer in significant made caused climate change, driver of a hybrid, owner of solar panels and a super energy efficient house, I am probably much more of an environmentally concerned member than many in this forum. I think this ethanol stuff was a mistake.

btw - I kept records on my previous two motorcycles and they got way better gas mileage without ethanol.

I'm not the most "environmentally friendly" person out there and to each his own and I don't have any qualms with anybody who is. I worked at a Yamaha dealership from '95-'98, servicing as I mentioned before, ATV's and snowmobiles and back in the Carb Days, I had numerous customers(farmers and enthusiast) that would bring their machines in with starting/rough running issues and they would crap when I gave them an estimate on parts and labor and I would have to explain to them that the carbs would have to be rebuilt with new main jets, needle valves, needles and gaskets and one reason for this was that they would let their snowmobiles sit all summer or ATV's in winter, without draining the tanks, lines and bowls and with the humidity we have here in Wisc. the fuel would create a chalky crap that was darn near impossible to scrape off. tried soaking the parts in carb cleaner overnight and you still couldn't get it out, so it was just cheaper to get a rebuild kit and they would save some money on the labor cost. And yes I would see them again the next year for the same issues, Oh well. But yes it is "crap" and IMHO I do what I can to keep me from spending hours in the garage, instead of out riding.
My fuel mileage averages at least 2MPG better, whether I'm solo, 2-up or towing a trailer, so I use non-ethanol fuel anytime I can find it.
Mac

[BajaRon]

As a firm believer in significant made caused climate change, driver of a hybrid, owner of solar panels and a super energy efficient house, I am probably much more of an environmentally concerned member than many in this forum. I think this ethanol stuff was a mistake.

btw - I kept records on my previous two motorcycles and they got way better gas mileage without ethanol.

I don't think I've ever met someone who has no interest in preserving the planet. But when something is just about feeling good in the name of 'Planet Rescue' but actually does no good. Or does harm. Then I think it reasonable to oppose it.

Ethanol fuel clearly falls into this category. But the 'Facts' are cherry picked to make a case when, if the whole picture were known, I think people would change their minds.

I'm not so sure electric vehicles don't fall into this same category. At least the current versions. When you look at the whole picture. Generating and transporting the electricity, mining the rare materials to make the batteries. And the hazardous materials disposal process required for spent batteries to keep it from getting into the environment. It's not as simple as not using fossil fuels in the vehicle.

Unfortunately, when there is money to be made. The 'Facts' can be generated rather than reported.

[Sccar]

That’s all I use in my motorcycles and lawn mower.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

As a firm believer in significant made caused climate change, driver of a hybrid, owner of solar panels and a super energy efficient house, I am probably much more of an environmentally concerned member than many in this forum. I think this ethanol stuff was a mistake.

It is, however, a better choice as an octane booster than the alternatives. Here is what I wrote in another thread last year. http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/s...=1#post1316057

Given the lower energy output and lower MPG of E10, when compared to non-E I'm doubtful of any cost savings with non-E. Every pump of non-E regular I've seen is higher priced than premium.

The move to E gas was prompted in large part to high levels of imported oil, the fact that corn is home grown, and its ability to boost octane number and help with emission control. One of the drives to E15 is to get more power via compression boost. The original octane booster, tetraethyl lead, is an environmental poison. I read years ago that traces of lead have been found on high mountain top water sources. The only place it could have come from was vapor from gasoline burned in vehicles. The replacement for ethyl was MTBE, but it too is an environmental pollutant when gasoline containing it leaks into the ground, not an uncommon problem.

As an octane booster and oxygenator, and having a lower pollution factor, ethanol looks to be the best choice. From the standpoint of energy output, not including the argument it takes more energy to produce it than it produces, and the impact on food supply, it is a poor choice. As in all things of life, there are no easy answers!

Have I not been paying attention, or has the push for E-15 slacked off? Also, interestingly, the US is forecast to be a net oil exporter within about 5 years. Then about 20 years later we will once again become net importers.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

I'm not so sure electric vehicles don't fall into this same category. At least the current versions. When you look at the whole picture. Generating and transporting the electricity, mining the rare materials to make the batteries. And the hazardous materials disposal process required for spent batteries to keep it from getting into the environment. It's not as simple as not using fossil fuels in the vehicle.

The best transportation energy option from an environmental standpoint is solar power coupled with fuel cells. Use solar generated electricity to disassociate water molecules into hydrogen and oxygen and fuel cells to combine them back into water. The heat that is generated from the fuel cell process and friction losses of the vehicle will offset the heat energy of the sun that is captured in the power generation process. All energy eventually degrades into low level heat. The solar cell/fuel cell process just degrades it by a different path.

[Mikey]

Whenever I head to the airport with my friend
for a ride in his Cessna, which is often
I always fill my spider with aviation fuel
Big Fun

I bet it's tons of fun!!

[shroth]

After spending a few years in the petroleum industry, I'll avoid ethanol whenever possible......but I'm not rabid about it. I've seen internal damage to gas dispensers & watch manufacturers of petroleum equipment develop special O rings that could stand up to ethanol. I've yet to be able to explain the dry rotting of O rings INSIDE a gas dispenser where there's no air or sunlight.

Think they can make a diesel Spyder?? Ah....biodiesel has it's own set of issues. Now that I will get rabid about!!

[Bob Denman]

Think they can make a diesel Spyder?? Ah....biodiesel has it's own set of issues. Now that I will get rabid about!!

That would be just great: all of the disadvantages of more expensive fuel that gets moldy, and none of the fun of a high-winding engine!

Where are you going to hide the DEF tank anyway: one of the saddlebags?

[Easy Rider]

I feel it made the corn farmers richer,

but it still attracts moisture

If you mean that it allowed a lot of small farmers to actually see a small profit.....some for the first time in decades.....then you are right about that.

But it does not "attract" water. It absorbs or combines with water that it comes in contact with......but it doesn't "attract" anything.

[Easy Rider]

Also, interestingly, the US is forecast to be a net oil exporter within about 5 years. Then about 20 years later we will once again become net importers.

IF.....the CAFE standards are relaxed and the sales trends toward LESS fuel efficient vehicles continues......those benchmarks might change.

[Easy Rider]

I've yet to be able to explain the dry rotting of O rings INSIDE a gas dispenser where there's no air or sunlight.

Maybe that's because it is not "dry rotting" at all.

All "rotting" is a chemical reaction and free oxygen and/or sunlight is not always required.

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

If you mean that it allowed a lot of small farmers to actually see a small profit.....some for the first time in decades.....then you are right about that.

But it does not "attract" water. It absorbs or combines with water that it comes in contact with......but it doesn't "attract" anything.

As in short / tiny .......... Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd the farmers that are selling their CORN for " Ethanol " imho are almost entirely " Conglomerates " ie. Mega Farms ........ jmho ........... Mike

[Deanna777]

I put non-ethanol gas in my riding lawn mower.

Also I put " regular unleaded gas "in my spyder.

There are a few gas stations in Vermont that sell non-ethanol gas.

Deanna

[Easy Rider]

........ Annnnnnnnnnnnnnnd the farmers that are selling their CORN for " Ethanol " imho are almost entirely " Conglomerates " ie. Mega Farms ........ jmho ........... Mike

Farmers usually sell their corn on the open market and don't usually know where it will end up.....ANY of them.
And I am not guessing, I was one.

Some of the biggest ethanol producers are cooperatives created by lots of farmers, many/most of them certainly not "mega" by any means.

Your HO is wrong. And your "joke" is not funny.

[Mad Mac]

If you mean that it allowed a lot of small farmers to actually see a small profit.....some for the first time in decades.....then you are right about that.

But it does not "attract" water. It absorbs or combines with water that it comes in contact with......but it doesn't "attract" anything.

ATTRACT/ABSORB......tit- for- tat, play on words in my opinion. And like Blueknight said..... MEGA farms....been to Iowa lately?? Mac

[Easy Rider]

...been to Iowa lately?? Mac

Yes. My brother-in-law still farms there.
His "company" consists of him, one neighbor, one son and a couple of grand-sons who think they are farmers but still are in grade school.

Is that what you mean by a "Mega farm" ??

[Mad Mac]

Yes. My brother-in-law still farms there.
His "company" consists of him, one neighbor, one son and a couple of grand-sons who think they are farmers but still are in grade school.

Is that what you mean by a "Mega farm" ??

How many 4x4 "dualie" J.D./Intl.'s does he have operating on his farm? Heck, Wisc. even grows a lot of corn but it is mainly used for feed, since we rate 2nd to Calif. in the dairy industry. Mac