CB Trouble AGAIN -- VENT and Dealer BLACK EYE

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

I'm confused. What dongle are you referring to, the BRP BT dongle to connect the audio system to a BT helmet headset, or the Sena BT dongle that plugs into a handheld CB to connect to your BT helmet? At this time there is no way to use a wired helmet headset with a handheld CB and use the onboard audio system at the same time.

I am referring to the BRP BT dongle that connects the audio system to a BT helmet headset .... and here is why I think it will work (this is the configuration for my husbands Indian Roadmaster):

• JMCB-2003 -- handle bar mounted CB
• JMDM-IPBT-JCB03 -- a Bluetooth interface module for the above CB (provides a wired connection, 6-pin plug; must be mounted water tight ... just like the dongle, in the frunk would be a good place).
• Standard J&M headset with a lower cord that matches the JMDM interface plug.
• The Indian has BT integrated into it's audio system and has a "slot" for "headset" preprogrammed.
• So, we simply paired the CB as a headset (actually paired the JMDM module as a headset) and all the audio flows through a wired connection. The reason for doing this was the sound quality from even the best Bluetooth headsets leaves something to be desired and husband already has compromised hearing (so needs the best quality he can get ... wired provides that).
• The only "downside" is the loss of digital volume control to the headset; it is handled by the volume wheel on the top of the J&M CB and is easy to use.

This solution is not cheap ... but the J&M units are high quality and husbands has worked without issue for nearly two years. Of course, I would have to come up with a mount for the CB, mount point for the BT interface, mount for the antenna, and a power source (don't recall if BRP provides any switched connectors for accessory use; Indian does).

So .... for anyone looking to ditch the BRP CB .. I am fairly certain the above will work (that is IF the BT dongle provides the ability to pair ANY Bluetooth device as a headset).

All the best ..... Ann

BTW ... we can't take credit for this. Another Indian owner initially tried just a BT headset and hated the sound quality ... so contacted J&M to see if they had any ideas. As it turned out, they had JUST come out with the JMDM interface and he decided to try it out. Hubby was just getting ready to purchase the Indian at the time and spotted this guys thread on one of the forums ... we worked the CB install into the purchase and the dealer put it all in before we picked up the bike.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

......

• JMCB-2003 -- handle bar mounted CB
• JMDM-IPBT-JCB03 -- a Bluetooth interface module for the above CB (provides a wired connection, 6-pin plug; must be mounted water tight ... just like the dongle, in the frunk would be a good place).
• Standard J&M headset with a lower cord that matches the JMDM interface plug.

......
This solution is not cheap ... but the J&M units are high quality and husbands has worked without issue for nearly two years. Of course, I would have to come up with a mount for the CB, mount point for the BT interface, mount for the antenna, and a power source (don't recall if BRP provides any switched connectors for accessory use; Indian does).

So .... for anyone looking to ditch the BRP CB .. I am fairly certain the above will work (that is IF the BT dongle provides the ability to pair ANY Bluetooth device as a headset).

Very interesting setup. May be pricey but it looks like, without doing detailed addition, it is still cheaper than the BRP CB. If my BRP CB wasn't working so well I'd be tempted to go this route myself. When it comes to pairing BT is pretty much BT, regardless of brand. If the BT standards are adhered to the BT radio waves don't know or care who or where they come from or go to.

I find it very interesting that a company like J & M, who do a lot with Bluetooth, would still spend the $$ to develop a system utilizing wired headsets. To me it is a strong affirmation of the value of wired vs BT when it comes to headsets. Almost makes me want to say to all those wired helmet and CB naysayers, "Screw you!"

If you decide to go this way I would give Motorcycle Dave a call and see what he can supply. If he doesn't handle J & M products then give Sierra Electronics a call. They handle Sena and J & M and in my limited dealings with them in the past they have been great to work with.

When I went to Homecoming with my nephew his early generation Scala BT helmet paired with no problem to a fairly new Sena SR10 CB adapter. Worked good, maybe not super great but good, for communicating with me and my BRP CB.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Ed Davis, edsets.com, has really good wired headsets if you're not firmly committed to J & M headsets.

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

Okay ....Spyder is back home. Is it fixed? Don't know yet ... but I am concerned that it is not (C&S Fun Center has made it clear they have no ability to test transmit / receive in real world conditions). You would think a simple hand held and a BRP headset would do that .... neither of which is too expensive. But, sigh, it is obvious (to me) that they don't really care if it is fixed.

Anyway, the noise that I complained about is still there (though I have not determined if it still overrides the ability of the CB to receive without static). Here is the "noise" I am talking about:

• Turn key on, DO NOT start the Spyder
• Go to the CB settings and run the squelch so that NO BARS are showing and it is in a constant RX condition.
• Listen in the headset; a constant purring / rhythmic static that WAS NOT there prior to the compressor replacement

I recorded it and sent the recording to my contact at BRP customer support. Wish I could attach it here, but I don't see a way as it is an invalid file type. Note that I do not believe it is the compressor as I have pulled it's fuse and the noise persists. When I voiced my continued concerns with C&S Fun Center -- they said it was time for another dealer to take a look as they can't test the CB. Well DUH, that is why I fought so hard to get the Spyder to a different dealer -- something either isn't grounded or is damaged (and if damaged, it happened when the compressor was replaced).

I will update once I know if the static on receive is still there .... thinking it probably will be (but I really hope not).

Do you suppose the TX Lemon Law applies to dealer installed accessories? If it is still bad; this will be the FIFTH repair for the same reason.

All the Best ..... Ann

[classicvw]

I'm fairly certain that lemon laws only apply to repairs to the vehicle as manufactured and not dealer or owner installed accessories.


In my previous post I think I mentioned (apologies if I didn't) that even a vehicle's wiring loom can cause radio interference. I don't know if that's the case because not all CB owners have this issue. But I guess what experts are saying is you can chase some interference issues forever and not solve them completely.

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

I'm fairly certain that lemon laws only apply to repairs to the vehicle as manufactured and not dealer or owner installed accessories.


In my previous post I think I mentioned (apologies if I didn't) that even a vehicle's wiring loom can cause radio interference. I don't know if that's the case because not all CB owners have this issue. But I guess what experts are saying is you can chase some interference issues forever and not solve them completely.

Thank you for the feedback .... something had to have happened during the compressor replacement (IMHO). The interference was NOT there before the compressor was replaced and the CB had performed flawlessly for several months before the compressor blew. I am down to the point of pulling another fuse (fuel pump ... F8 on the left hand box) to see if that will mitigate the noise. Not sure if I can, safely, do this ... although since I have no intention of starting the bike, it might eliminate (or prove) something.

Again ... thank you .... all the best .... Ann

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

.....
Anyway, the noise that I complained about is still there (though I have not determined if it still overrides the ability of the CB to receive without static). Here is the "noise" I am talking about:

• Turn key on, DO NOT start the Spyder
• Go to the CB settings and run the squelch so that NO BARS are showing and it is in a constant RX condition.
• Listen in the headset; a constant purring / rhythmic static that WAS NOT there prior to the compressor replacement

....
Do you suppose the TX Lemon Law applies to dealer installed accessories? If it is still bad; this will be the FIFTH repair for the same reason.

I just checked my CB. I get a constant static but no rhythmic noise of any sort. Did you run this test with the Spyder out in the open away from any electrical noise? I did mine in the garage with all the fluorescent lights turned off but there still may have been some other external source for the static.

I don't know if this has any bearing on your issue at all but my headset volume gets muted for a couple of seconds about 10 seconds after I take off in 1st gear. It also mutes momentarily whenever I do a hard turn and Nanny apparently kicks in a bit. There is some sort of oddball interaction between the radio or the headset feed from the CB unit and the VSS. This muting affects the radio sound even when the CB is off, the intercom volume is off, and the VOX is off.

I'm doubtful you'll get anywhere with a lemon law approach. But, contact the State Attorney General's office, or an ombudsman in the DMV if there is one. You might get some action that way. But do that only if you end up getting stonewalled by BRP. When I talked with some BRP customer care folks at Homecoming they genuinely indicated a desire to help an owner in a weird situation. It was too late to do anything about the CB I had that got water in it, but they expressed a wish that they could have been involved when I discovered the problem. I believe they are separate group from the dealer contact technicians.

[Easy Rider]

The interference was NOT there before the compressor was replaced and the CB had performed flawlessly for several months before the compressor blew.

I think you are at a point now where you need to give it a "functional test" and if it works similar to what it did before, then be happy that it's fixed.

BUT.....some other thoughts that may or may not be helpful:

I've been doing 2-way radio since I got into electronics about 55 years ago.
A CB is an excellent noise detector.....since it uses AM modulation.
About the only better noise detector is a hand held AM radio.

Regardless of what kind of radio or vehicle, a CB will pick up "noise" from nearby power lines when there is a bad connection or a failing filter.
That can be MOST annoying when you have on a headset......and accessing the squelch is difficult.

The J&M bar mount CB on my Vulcan screeches whenever the engine starts getting hot and the radiator fan runs. Thankfully the squelch on that radio is easier to reach.......and normal communications are still possible.

Did the compressor blow a fuse when it failed ? If so, maybe it took something in the charging system with it......like a diode in the regulator.

Did you actually re-activate the LEDs ?

If you can find a cheap battery powered "transistor" radio, it might make a good noise detector to try and find the source of your noise.

Good luck.

P.S. This has been going on for so long that "Mr. Murphy" says something else might have happened during that time that has nothing to do with the compressor failure.

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

I think you are at a point now where you need to give it a "functional test" and if it works similar to what it did before, then be happy that it's fixed.
.......
Did the compressor blow a fuse when it failed ? If so, maybe it took something in the charging system with it......like a diode in the regulator.

Did you actually re-activate the LEDs ?

If you can find a cheap battery powered "transistor" radio, it might make a good noise detector to try and find the source of your noise.

Good luck.

P.S. This has been going on for so long that "Mr. Murphy" says something else might have happened during that time that has nothing to do with the compressor failure.

Functional test performed today -- and I was right the rhythmic static overrides the ability to receive without static..... BUT, only if I am moving. If I am sitting still I have about 1/2 to 3/4 mile transmit and receive ability with decent clarity (about as good as it was before the compressor was replaced).

BRP actually had the dealer hook up the LEDs when the CB was replaced (and I had hooked some of them back up before the compressor replacement myself). Note that this noise was present with ALL LEDs unhooked and I was unable to receive without static ... so I am still looking at something other than the LEDs. Additionally, I have added ferrite beads to all the LEDs to mitigate noise and chose a "wide band" type to cover frequencies likely to interfere with the CB.

We may actually have an old transistor radio around somewhere .... not sure it will actually receive anything, but might still work as a noise detector. Wouldn't any noise present also affect the AM band of the BRP radio? I am able to receive AM, FM, and NOAA just fine (no static).

Yes the compressor blew a fuse .... but so did the heated grips after the compressor was replaced (pinched wire in the heated grips circuit). For the compressor replacement, then entire back of the bike has to be removed .... including the rear cargo module. In order to do this, there are a large number of components that must be disconnected. Note that the rear portion of the entertainment harness is routed around the back of the bike just underneath the rear trunk and looks to fit into a channel. What if something was not properly plugged back together? What if a wire was pinched in the entertainment harness (won't be the first wire this "tech" pinched)?

I sent the recording to BRP customer support and they have passed it on to the technical team -- I am going to let them tell me what the next step is. Have made it clear that this dealer doesn't have the means to test the CB and seems unwilling to spend a few dollars to do that (a hand held and a headset is all they need).

Finally ... hubby dug out an ancient SWR meter (J&M suggested checking to see if the antenna is damaged or no longer tuned properly). Also, I am down to pulling fuses and checking for the rhythmic static with the motor off. So far I have pulled:

• The compressor / horn / heated grips -- F5 right box
• The fuel pump -- F8 left box

The noise persists

Next will be the turn signals ... all in an attempt to isolate the problem. I suspect, however, that the offending component is IN the same portion of the wiring as the CB itself (say, the entertainment harness). Maybe when we remove the Tupperware to do our SWR check, I will take a close look at the instructions for CB install and check all the pluggable components myself. I have taken the Tupperware off enough times now that I no longer have to look at the book (not sure that is a good thing).
Sigh .... at least we had a good ride today -- not going to let a bad CB ruin that. Beautiful day -- 150 mile round trip for lunch.

Thank you for the suggestions .... will keep this thread up to date as things progress (or degrade) .... Ann

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

...
I sent the recording to BRP customer support and they have passed it on to the technical team -- I am going to let them tell me what the next step is. Have made it clear that this dealer doesn't have the means to test the CB and seems unwilling to spend a few dollars to do that (a hand held and a headset is all they need).

I believe you really have BRP folks scratching their heads over this one finally. That is good. I sure can't think of anything that would be causing a rhythmic static. We're rooting for you. Hang in there! The problem will get solved in due time! I applaud your persistence, tenacity, and diplomacy!

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

I believe you really have BRP folks scratching their heads over this one finally. That is good. I sure can't think of anything that would be causing a rhythmic static. We're rooting for you. Hang in there! The problem will get solved in due time! I applaud your persistence, tenacity, and diplomacy!

Well .... I can't take all the credit for "persistence, tenacity, and diplomacy" .... I have a nasty temper and it has taken years of practice, as well as some solid advice from hubby (spydercowboy / hogcowboy) to get to the point where I can see things through without killing someone. His mantra has always been ... document, document, document ... state the facts, in clear and simple language, keep the emotion out of it (even though there are "flames" burning the keyboard as you type). He taught me well .... I hope it pays off with a permanent solution.

Once again ... thank you for the response .... Ann

[Easy Rider]

Wouldn't any noise present also affect the AM band of the BRP radio? I am able to receive AM, FM, and NOAA just fine (no static).

Maybe but on the AM band only.

And you need to tune to a frequency where there is NO actual radio signal present. The signal on AM radio is SOOOO much stronger that it will over-ride most noise if the station is very close.

And the noise filtering and selectivity is better with commercial radio too.

And I just HAVE to say this, based on a LOT of years of electronic trouble shooting:
You NEED to completely disconnect the LEDs.....yes, again.....and LEAVE them disconnected until the problem is solved.
That is a well known problem with a lot of different applications similar to what you are doing.

I think the critical clue at this point is: That the noise appears as soon as the ignition power is ON, even before the engine starts running.
Assuming, of course, that is the same noise that you hear when moving only worse.

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

Maybe but on the AM band only.

And you need to tune to a frequency where there is NO actual radio signal present. The signal on AM radio is SOOOO much stronger that it will over-ride most noise if the station is very close.

And the noise filtering and selectivity is better with commercial radio too.

And I just HAVE to say this, based on a LOT of years of electronic trouble shooting:
You NEED to completely disconnect the LEDs.....yes, again.....and LEAVE them disconnected until the problem is solved.
That is a well known problem with a lot of different applications similar to what you are doing.

I think the critical clue at this point is: That the noise appears as soon as the ignition power is ON, even before the engine starts running.
Assuming, of course, that is the same noise that you hear when moving only worse.

Thanks again for all the information ... we have undertaken additional testing; as follows:

• Functional test -- took a long ride and the static on receive is still so bad that I cannot understand a word that is said; transmit still okay. And, yes, it is the same static I hear when sitting still .... just MUCH worse.
• Individual fuse test -- both boxes and all the "F" and "J" fuses that we felt safe in pulling (some marked console or ECM we left alone). This was key off, pull fuse, key on and listen -- key off, boot down, replace fuse ... pull the next one). The noise was only eliminated when the audio fuse was pulled (no surprise, no power to the radio). The noise DID NOT CHANGE when any of the light fuses were pulled .... says to me that the noise is NOT coming from the LEDs.
• SWR test -- hubby had a meter (probably 40 years old; so we may want to freshen it a bit). Plugged meter in, calibrated, took a reading at 1 and 40. In both cases the meter is pegged in the RED zone. This is a quality antenna from J&M that was working without issue prior to the compressor replacement. J&M seems to think there is an underlying ground issue since the compressor replacement -- I am inclined to agree. Per the Midwest Manual, there is a grounding harness in the Spyder -- so even though the ground cables are definitely connected for radio and CB; they may NOT be truly grounded if the piece of metal has lost contact with the ground harness that goes all the way back to the battery. J&M says we need to solve the ground issue before making any adjustments (and they told me how to do that).

So, we are back to a fundamental ground issue with the Spyder since the compressor replacement. Oh .... AND another bit of damage that occurred when the CB was replaced. The right fuse box now has a busted locking tab on the bottom (see photos). This has all been reported to BRP customer care and I am waiting for them to tell me the next step. I have made it clear in my last to notes that this dealer has NO INTEREST in performing any level of testing -- they have no hand held CB, no SWR meter, nothing. Need to go to someone that has the equipment to check the ground, check the antenna, and give it a real road test -- obviously, C&S Fun Center either can't (or won't).

BrokenLockTab.JPGGoodLockTab.JPG

All the best ...... Ann

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

We decided to take a crack at a couple of additional tests, as follows:

• Knowing there is a ground harness, we decided to see if we could ground the antenna by creating a cable that ran from the antenna ground to the ground lug on the battery (where the ground harness connects). This made no difference ... so, now I am wondering. Is there is a way to check ground with a meter?
• The other check we made was to create the noise and then turn the "kill switch" to the OFF (not run) position -- thinking that this would take much of the "engine" electrical components out of the picture. Again, no difference.

Then I spotted this quote in another thread about "noise from USB ports" .... from jcthorne:

If you ground both ends of a shielded cable you create a current loop and that is not good. You only ground one end of a shielded cable so it drains. I've been working with analog signal cables (twisted pair shielded) for years and every time someone has a signal problem I find that they have grounded the shield on both ends.

JT

Given the above, is it possible that some wires were pinched in such a way to create this "current loop"? If so, would this show up as persistent noise that gets worse with movement? Finally, how do I prove it? How do I find it?

Note all the LEDs that are still hooked up each have their own ferrite bead .... I added these as a means to mitigate any possible noise from the LEDs because I knew BRP would most likely point at the LEDs; even though this latest batch of noise did not show up until the compressor was replaced (and the rear cargo module removed) .... at the time the LEDs were ALL disconnected (save the HMT).

As always ... thanks for your suggestions, thanks for listening ..... Ann

[stevencovert]

We decided to take a crack at a couple of additional tests, as follows:

• Knowing there is a ground harness, we decided to see if we could ground the antenna by creating a cable that ran from the antenna ground to the ground lug on the battery (where the ground harness connects). This made no difference ... so, now I am wondering. Is there is a way to check ground with a meter?
• The other check we made was to create the noise and then turn the "kill switch" to the OFF (not run) position -- thinking that this would take much of the "engine" electrical components out of the picture. Again, no difference.

Then I spotted this quote in another thread about "noise from USB ports" .... from jcthorne:



Given the above, is it possible that some wires were pinched in such a way to create this "current loop"? If so, would this show up as persistent noise that gets worse with movement? Finally, how do I prove it? How do I find it?

Note all the LEDs that are still hooked up each have their own ferrite bead .... I added these as a means to mitigate any possible noise from the LEDs because I knew BRP would most likely point at the LEDs; even though this latest batch of noise did not show up until the compressor was replaced (and the rear cargo module removed) .... at the time the LEDs were ALL disconnected (save the HMT).

As always ... thanks for your suggestions, thanks for listening ..... Ann

Hi Ann,

I posted some info on another thread: http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/s...er-ports/page2

Anything that changes voltage levels can put out noise. If your hubby has that meter, he might know what a switching supply is and look over the bike for any add-ons that use any supply. Sounds like pulling fuses would have isolated any USB devices, but if wired directly to the battery it'll have it's own fuse inline.

I am curious about what you mean when you say "noise gets worse with movement" (I may have missed it!). The noise changes pitch or gets louder when you drive?

If I remember you have noise with the key ON and the red switch (engine kill) OFF. I'm trying to think what systems are powered in that condition - fuel pump? Since it started after the air pump was replaced, what do they have to take off to get to it? What gets unplugged that may not be plugged back in well?

Seems like the ground should be OK since you checked it. You shouldn't have a ground loop since the shield for the antenna is inside the base of the antenna and it not grounded at the antenna itself. The shield in the cable is grounded down near the CB somewhere, or at the CB unit itself when plugged in. I don't have a CB, so cannot check.

If the case of the CB is metal, you can check continuity from the case to ground nearby to be sure it is grounded with a multimeter. You could even add a wire from the case to ground. If you grab the CB unit, does the noise change? That might suggest the CB itself is not grounded well. May sound silly, but if touching the CB changes the noise a lot in some way, pull it off, wrap it with metal screen door material or aluminum foil, put it back on and ground the screen door material. This will create whats called a Faraday cage that blocks most signals.

And last for today - can you unplug the antenna from the CB and test?
Being an electrical engineer your problem has me really curious! Hoping to hear something positive soon!

Steve

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

First I will answer questions from the last post -- thank you Steve, for the information:

Sounds like pulling fuses would have isolated any USB devices, but if wired directly to the battery it'll have it's own fuse inline.

These are "plug and play" devices from Spyderpops, so they have power bridges that plug in between the turn signals and the Spyder.

I am curious about what you mean when you say "noise gets worse with movement" (I may have missed it!). The noise changes pitch or gets louder when you drive?

Not so much louder or change in pitch, it just overrides any reception and there is a great amount of "cut out" when receiving.

If I remember you have noise with the key ON and the red switch (engine kill) OFF. I'm trying to think what systems are powered in that condition - fuel pump? Since it started after the air pump was replaced, what do they have to take off to get to it? What gets unplugged that may not be plugged back in well?

Correct on the noise with the kill OFF -- tried that and there was no change. As for what was taken off for the air pump ... the entire rear cargo module (and anything plugged into it from the main harness). We have inspected all the plugs we can reach ... even unplugged, checked for bent pins, and plugged back together. No change.

Seems like the ground should be OK since you checked it. You shouldn't have a ground loop since the shield for the antenna is inside the base of the antenna and it not grounded at the antenna itself. The shield in the cable is grounded down near the CB somewhere, or at the CB unit itself when plugged in. I don't have a CB, so cannot check.

On recommendations from a local CB repair guy -- we checked the cable and ground by continuity from the center post to the threads on the brass block and also from the outside of the cable to the ground strap connection next to the antenna itself (inside the left speaker pod). So, I am certain we now have a good ground for the antenna.

If you grab the CB unit, does the noise change? That might suggest the CB itself is not grounded well.

Makes no difference in the noise if the CB is touched. It makes a HUGE difference if the antenna is touched .... see below for what we have found this indicates.

And last for today - can you unplug the antenna from the CB and test?
Being an electrical engineer your problem has me really curious! Hoping to hear something positive soon!

We have unplugged the antenna and tested what we could on the antenna itself -- CB repair indicated that we should have continuity from tip to tail (we don't -- again, see below). Well ... I think the following is a HUGE positive. I am now in direct contact with the regional technical guy and he has asked for a few things. We had an extended discussion and I am confident he will see this through to a final positive outcome.

OK ... so here is the update.

Since we did not get good readings when checking continuity of the antenna itself, I went down to the local truck stop and picked up a cheap (but tunable) antenna. It has the same threads as the J&M and we decided to see if we could tune it. Well ... results are better ... but still not good as our reading on the SWR meter is still well over 2 and not very adjustable. So, I called J&M and reported these results .... they are convinced that the J&M antenna is damaged (probably a cracked fiberglass staff) and needs to be replaced. They also indicated that if something in the entertainment harness was pinched in such a way to create a current loop, transmit would not work. In addition, they also believe we still have a grounding issue (like a pinched wire somewhere) and that we need to solve that before proceeding with tuning the "cheap" antenna. Once we have all of it solved and tuned the best we can ... they will do an antenna exchange under warranty so we can have the good quality J&M back on the spyder.

As for my conversation with BRP technical -- seems like C&S Fun Center is pretty well done with this spyder and I, for one, am glad for that. Since I had all the Tupperware off the Spyder, the tech asked that I perform a resistance test on the radio grounds (I believe this will eliminate the main harness as the source of the problem). He described the radio plug and what pins to check (three black wires in three consecutive pins). Easy to spot and fairly easy to test .... looking for Ohms with a handheld multi-meter. He said don't be surprised if there is a small amount of resistance ... what he was looking for was a difference. With the meter set to 20K ... 0.002 ohms read on each of the wires.

One thing he did say was that a CB without an antenna is very bad for the CB and can render it inoperable. We, effectively, were operating without an antenna since we know the J&M is toast. So, now I am wondering if we are actually fighting two problems -- a ground issue (something draining to ground that shouldn't) and a "blown" CB. Either one could cause problems with the ability to tune the antenna and I will voice this concern when I discuss results of our testing.

Bottom line, it looks like we will (finally) be able to take the Spyder to another dealer to have this resolved. Before we select either one 30 miles or one 65 miles away, I will find out if they have an SWR meter "in house" or are willing to get one ... so THEY can check the tune on the antenna themselves and make sure there are no ground issues before returning the spyder to us. These meters are cheap (less than $20), it just boggles the mind that C&S Fun Center doesn't have and, apparently, won't go out and get one.

As always, thank you for the suggestions .... will keep this updated as we move forward .... Ann

[Peter Aawen]

FINALLY!!

I hope I'm not celebrating for you too early, but it does sound like there might be some 'light at the end of the tunnel' with a Tech somewhere interested in solving your CB issues!!

[2bears]

I just had dealer install a cb on my 2016 RT. Can't use it. They say headset is on backorder and will be 3 months to get one. I asked the technician question on the display wich one was the squelch and he replied, "what's a squelch". Dealer tells me they will not be installing any more cb's, they say they have been discontinued on the 2018 models.

Does the headset have to be connected to receive? They didn't know and neither do I. Sure can't trust them to have checked the antenna swr either with an answer like that.

Spyder_cowgirl, one thing nobody has covered is the flux index has been high and the hf bands have been crazy, in laymens terms the static has been bad because of the sunspot activity, yep I know, now you have herd 1001 causes for your static. An SWR of greater 3 to 1 will smoke the final transistors in a cb. Anything over 1.3 to 1 you loose efficiency.

Does anybody know who manufactures the cb's that Can Am uses?

Chuck

[Easy Rider]

Does the headset have to be connected to receive?

Does anybody know who manufactures the cb's that Can Am uses?

I don't know if the headset has to be connected or not; I haven't had a chance to try that yet......because the first headset I got from BRP went bad.

J&M makes/sells both the radios and the headsets. I bet you could get one from them in about 3 days.

[JIM EVANS]

i installed my cb and it works fine.. 2104 rtl i did add an additional ground to the antenna ran from the antenna nut down to the frame.. and i also grounded the cb off the chasis of the cb to the frame.. other than taking a while to dial in the correct settings ... has been trouble and noise free

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

[QUOTE=2bears;1305520]
Does anybody know who manufactures the cb's that Can Am uses?

Chuck[/QUOTE
Radio Sound. They make radios for many makes of m/c's, including Honda, Indian, and HD.

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

I just had dealer install a cb on my 2016 RT. Can't use it. They say headset is on backorder and will be 3 months to get one. I asked the technician question on the display wich one was the squelch and he replied, "what's a squelch". Dealer tells me they will not be installing any more cb's, they say they have been discontinued on the 2018 models.

Does the headset have to be connected to receive? They didn't know and neither do I. Sure can't trust them to have checked the antenna swr either with an answer like that.

Spyder_cowgirl, one thing nobody has covered is the flux index has been high and the hf bands have been crazy, in laymens terms the static has been bad because of the sunspot activity, yep I know, now you have herd 1001 causes for your static. An SWR of greater 3 to 1 will smoke the final transistors in a cb. Anything over 1.3 to 1 you loose efficiency.

Does anybody know who manufactures the cb's that Can Am uses?

Chuck

Yes, the CB output only goes through the headset ... can't redirect to the speakers (since it doubles as an intercom, I can sort of see this). As another post said ... go to the J&M site and get one of their headsets ... you just need a "lower cord" with the seven pin connector (and I know J&M has them because hubby has a spare lower cord for his J&M headsets).

I am aware of the many causes of static .... have learned much with all these issues. Now, here is the curious part .... at the moment, the CB is "working" (it suddenly cleared up in the middle of a ride ... just as it suddenly went away). But, even though it is working .... we still can't tune the antenna (J&M says we must still have a ground issue). So, BRP is going to replace the entertainment harness ... thinking that something in it got "compromised" when the compressor was replaced (I am inclined to agree). We are currently waiting on parts .... I know they will need the bike for a day as this is NOT a short replacement (back end must be removed ... the whole "luggage" module; only six bolts, but you need to have a rack of some kind to slide it onto or it will get damaged).

And, yes, the CB is manufactured by RadioSound (as another post has already stated).

As always, thank you for the ideas ... hope you can get a J&M headset that will work for you .... Ann

[RinconRyder]

Anyway, the noise that I complained about is still there (though I have not determined if it still overrides the ability of the CB to receive without static). Here is the "noise" I am talking about:

• Turn key on, DO NOT start the Spyder
• Go to the CB settings and run the squelch so that NO BARS are showing and it is in a constant RX condition.
• Listen in the headset; a constant purring / rhythmic static that WAS NOT there prior to the compressor replacement

Quit screwing around with motorcycle people (BRP) and go find a mom & pop radio repair shop (two way radios). Ask the old guy to listen to your radio. He will probably be able to tell what the problem is and will certainly be able to test it.

[jprobins1578]

We recently purchased a new '16 RT-S Special. We ride with a group that rely heavily on CB communications so we asked the dealer to install the CB/Communications kit. After finally getting all the right parts delivered (with my help and the BRP rep's), their first installation attempt found that the Entertainment harness had a defective connector and that two pins were shorting out. The dealer ordered two more to be shipped overnight (one from another dealer & one from BRP supply chain). Both arrived with defective connectors from the manufacturer. They tried again from Canada and finally got one with complete connectors. They installed it and claimed to have tested it with the BRP headsets. They then delivered it to us (120 miles distant). We tested it and found a lot of static and no Rx. We decided to deal with it later. On a 850 mile ride that weekend, one of the members in our group commented on how wobbly the CB mast was. When we stopped at the next rest stop and tightened the mast using the BRP tool kit, all our Tx/Rx problems went away and it is working very well. HOWEVER, the BRP engineers never bother to try to connect the PTT cable they sell for the passenger headset connector because the 90 degree connector on both the PTT cable and the break away cable to the bike interfer with the passenger LH grip. I'm going to have to take the connector panel off and file new notches so the connector can be rotated 90 degrees clockwise to allow the PTT cable to connect. I had to explain to the dealer service desk what a PTT was used for on a CB. IMHO BRP needs to spend some training time with their dealers on communications options, installations and testing.

Ann, your tenacity in solving this problem is amazing. Well done!

[Spyder_Cowgirl]

Thought I would provide a brief update ... since I last posted, I have been able to dump the dealer that did all the damage and was able to pick a new dealer -- had two to choose from and picked the one that had the more experienced mechanic (the other was a new Spyder dealer, so tech not up to speed yet). Anyway, here is what has taken place:

• BRP replaced the entertainment harness -- thinking it may have been damaged when the compressor was replaced (no help).
• I had J&M warrantee the antenna and they confirmed that it was badly damaged, likely with a cracked staff ... so I was basically running the CB without an antenna until I purchased a cheap tunable one at the local truck stop (this made some difference, at least my reception is not complete static all the time ... once in a while, I can actually understand about 80% of what is said in among the static.
• Then the radio started acting up, where I would lose my tunes or get "locked out" with nothing but static in my headphones. Could not shut the static off without powering down the bike and letting it all reboot (very annoying). So, BRP replaced the radio .... and I am now convinced the loose ground strap belonged to the radio and probably toasted it. While I no longer lose my tunes or get locked out, the reception has not improved from when the antenna was replaced.
• So, now I am waiting on yet another CB (dealer has ordered it) -- this will be the fifth one, BTW. The BRP lead area tech agrees that the loose ground was probably the radio, and that the antenna was damaged when the compressor was replaced. So, that means that the fourth CB was essentially run without an antenna and was probably fried within minutes of use. During this CB replacement, BRP is going to ask the dealer to inspect the compressor install, the heated grips harness repair, the grounding harness (there are something like 6 to 8 ground points that all lead back to the battery), and will also authorize install of a ground strap from the CB itself to the motorcycle frame (I already have the strap). I am really hoping this works .... if it doesn't, BRP has already said they will have to replace the main harness.

On a more positive note, I did put 170 miles on an F3 Limited during the last repair (radio replacement) and that was fun. Still can't convince hubby that a third motorcycle is worth it, though.

Will let you know more ... when I know more ..... Ann