Best ECU flash results ever for me

[trikermutha]

[Bam Bam and Pebbles]

Oh! Since I'm on an RT: racing seems out of the question. (Unless they have a class for "Short Buses! )

Speak for yourself Bob.

[blacklightning]

Speak for yourself Bob.

I had a feeling that you would be the one to say that.
I am not one to do a lot of mods on my bike, but I am really interested in seeing how this will shake out in the future. I really love my F3T, but as with everything that I have ever owned (except my ZX14), more power would be a welcome upgrade. Who knows, if I get more power, I might actually have a desire to upgrade my sway bar and other suspension items.

[Bob Denman]

If you think like this guy:



Life will always have more flavor!

(Although every once in a while: it passes by quicker! )

[five-0]

If the ecu has a different program will the dealer be able to see that for warranty reasons?

[Firefly]

If the ecu has a different program will the dealer be able to see that for warranty reasons?

Good question.. and it will have varying answers I'm sure.

If something engine-wise was to go kaput and they found the custom mapping, they might raise a stink, but they cannot just 'void your warranty' due to the mapping. There has to be a connection between the mapping and the failure. For example a DPS failure might be hard to blame on the mapping change.

One thing that should be mentioned is that under certain circumstances your dealer might plug in to BUDS and reflash the whole thing back to stock or with new updates from BRP. Then you would lose the extra ummph. I'm curious if they have any discount for redoing the remapping under those circumstances?

[Bob Denman]

Will it cause a problem with the warranty, if something happens to the engine?
You better believe it!
What are the chances of something happening?



Personally: I think that a change to the electronics might be safer than a hardware change.

[Mike,P]

What is the projected cost of this reflash and when will it be available??

[Bob Denman]

If you take a look at their website: I believe that it shows a price of $350 in US, and $400 in Canadian dollars.

[Spyd_Piper]

If the ecu has a different program will the dealer be able to see that for warranty reasons?

No, there is no way for a dealer to know any changes within the ecu mapping. BUDS program is not a mapping program at all. It is only for vehicle setup, diagnostics and factory flash loading. Does nothing else. Cannot see or adjust maps in any manor.

However, there is a diagnostic history stored in ecu. It will store rpm use. This will show if the engine has ran over the stock rev limiter.

Simple answer is:
Under warranty (and worried at all) - leave the rev limiter stock.
Out of warranty - set rev limiter where wanted.


Any flash has no charge for future changes (like rev limit change after warranty period or fuel type change / added performance stuff etc down the road) Or to put back to stock at any time or to re-install if its rewritten by dealer for update. Every user and file is stored in a database. User pays shipping. Thats it.

[Bob Denman]

Simple answer is:
Under warranty (and worried at all) - leave the rev limiter stock.
Out of warranty - set rev limiter where wanted.

Any flash has no charge for future changes (like rev limit change after warranty period or fuel type change / added performance stuff etc down the road) Or to put back to stock at any time or to re-install if its rewritten by dealer for update. Every user and file is stored in a database. User pays shipping. Thats it.

Thanks for the quick reply!
Which begs another question: (Sorry! )
1.If the rev limiter is left stock: how much of an increase will be felt over the stock ECU's programming?
2. Would a modest increase in the rev limiter (let's say 8,400 rpm) Make more of a difference?
3. if so: how much?

Okay: THREE questions!

[TRLBLZR1]

Would like to know how this remapping effects the 2017 F3-S models like my D-500 (se). They're already tuned a little "hotter" and more aggressively setup (nanny etc.) than prior years. ~ Not to mention the S models also have more power stock. On that note: I've always wondered if the extra HP (on the S model) is exclusively due to ECM programming. Wouldn't surprise me.....

Years back I had friends in the radar detector business. (technicians) Their high end $300+ models had extra features that their $150 model didn't. To get those features, all you needed was a Philips screw driver. Peel off the black tape from the display and you had all the extra indicators! The electronics (antenna and everything) inside were identical!

[Firefly]

Would like to know how this remapping effects the 2017 F3-S models like my D-500 (se). They're already tuned a little "hotter" and more aggressively setup (nanny etc.) than prior years. ~ Not to mention the S models also have more power stock. On that note: I've always wondered if the extra HP (on the S model) is exclusively due to ECM programming. Wouldn't surprise me.....

Years back I had friends in the radar detector business. (technicians) Their high end $300+ models had extra features that their $150 model didn't. To get those features, all you needed was a Philips screw driver. Peel off the black tape from the display and you had all the extra indicators! The electronics (antenna and everything) inside were identical!

It's common for manufacturers to build units with all the features and then only unlock them for the higher models. Computer chips used to do this as well. The new Tesla comes with the 'extra' batteries for longer range, but they are not unlocked for use on the base model. So you get like 200 mile range and if you want the 275 or whatever it is then you pay them $7,000 and they unlock it for you with software.

Certainly the F3 and the S have the same engine components... any difference in HP is controlled in the ECM.

I look forward to sending mine off after I get some other issues fixed.

[Spyd_Piper]

Thanks for the quick reply!
Which begs another question: (Sorry! )
1.If the rev limiter is left stock: how much of an increase will be felt over the stock ECU's programming?
2. Would a modest increase in the rev limiter (let's say 8,400 rpm) Make more of a difference?
3. if so: how much?

Okay: THREE questions!

Rev Limit has nothing to do with power output.
Rev limit can extend top speed in a lower gear.
Or if peak power is above a factory rev limit or even if engine continue to pull well beyond it, then there is a benefit to raise limiter.
The 1330 continues to pull to 8800.

[Spyd_Piper]

Would like to know how this remapping effects the 2017 F3-S models like my D-500 (se). They're already tuned a little "hotter" and more aggressively setup (nanny etc.) than prior years. ~ Not to mention the S models also have more power stock. On that note: I've always wondered if the extra HP (on the S model) is exclusively due to ECM programming. Wouldn't surprise me.....

Years back I had friends in the radar detector business. (technicians) Their high end $300+ models had extra features that their $150 model didn't. To get those features, all you needed was a Philips screw driver. Peel off the black tape from the display and you had all the extra indicators! The electronics (antenna and everything) inside were identical!

Any Canam.

Keyword "little" hotter is fitting.

Aftermarket / performance world has different objectives than factory. Anything factory can be improved upon.

[Bob Denman]

Rev Limit has nothing to do with power output.
Rev limit can extend top speed in a lower gear.
Or if peak power is above a factory rev limit or even if engine continue to pull well beyond it, then there is a benefit to raise limiter.
The 1330 continues to pull to 8800.

I should have state my questions a bit differently...
Now that we know that the 1330 will build peak horsepower at 8,800 rpm: how much of it are we leaving "on the table", if the rev-limiter is either left stock, or only allowed to spin the engine to... let's say 8,400 rpm?

(I fully understand the concept of a rev-limiter being in place to protect the engine from being spun too fast. I also dig that shutting an engine down before it reaches it's power peak seems... wasteful! )
Oh! Thanks a bunch for putting up with my seemingly endless questions!

Just TWO more:
Have you run the 1330 on a dyno yet?
If you have: would you please post the results?

[Spyd_Piper]

I should have state my questions a bit differently...
Now that we know that the 1330 will build peak horsepower at 8,800 rpm: how much of it are we leaving "on the table", if the rev-limiter is either left stock, or only allowed to spin the engine to... let's say 8,400 rpm?

(I fully understand the concept of a rev-limiter being in place to protect the engine from being spun too fast. I also dig that shutting an engine down before it reaches it's power peak seems... wasteful! )
Oh! Thanks a bunch for putting up with my seemingly endless questions!

Just TWO more:
Have you run the 1330 on a dyno yet?
If you have: would you please post the results?

Where do you get that peak power is at 8800? Read slower.

I am not at liberty to give or post dyno information. Rather relevant or not.

You are asking specific questions but not giving specific information.

First- What bike do you have?

What fuel do you run?
What exhaust do you run? full or slip on?
Cat or not?
Air filter?
Air box modifications?


If a stock bike has peak power at 7250rpm. Would have one flash. Rider would use a specific rpm range
A bike with free flowing intake and exhaust modifications, good fuel and timing remap makes peak power at 8200. Would have an extended or different usable rpm range.

Anybody familiar with riding a bike can easily decide if extra rpm is usable or not. A flash should be very specific to a bike and its setup. One size fits all type of flashing is very poor.

[TRLBLZR1]

It's common for manufacturers to build units with all the features and then only unlock them for the higher models. Computer chips used to do this as well. The new Tesla comes with the 'extra' batteries for longer range, but they are not unlocked for use on the base model. So you get like 200 mile range and if you want the 275 or whatever it is then you pay them $7,000 and they unlock it for you with software.

Certainly the F3 and the S have the same engine components... any difference in HP is controlled in the ECM.

I look forward to sending mine off after I get some other issues fixed.

Exactly lol.... Disabled PC cores on chips etc.
That was my point....

20% gain on an ECU remap makes sense.
But if you're 95% of the way there on the S model...

Would really like some info on ECU remapping gains as it pertains to the 2017 F3-S models specifically.
Personally, I'd like a little more torque (down low before she howls/growls), but NOT at the expense of engine longevity/reliability. ~ Don't want to give up durability!

[Bob Denman]

Where do you get that peak power is at 8800? Read slower.

I am not at liberty to give or post dyno information. Rather relevant or not.

You are asking specific questions but not giving specific information.

First- What bike do you have?

What fuel do you run?
What exhaust do you run? full or slip on?
Cat or not?
Air filter?
Air box modifications?


If a stock bike has peak power at 7250rpm. Would have one flash. Rider would use a specific rpm range
A bike with free flowing intake and exhaust modifications, good fuel and timing remap makes peak power at 8200. Would have an extended or different usable rpm range.

Anybody familiar with riding a bike can easily decide if extra rpm is usable or not. A flash should be very specific to a bike and its setup. One size fits all type of flashing is very poor.

2018 RT-L
93 octane
stock intake & exhaust.

[Spyd_Piper]

2018 RT-L
93 octane
stock intake & exhaust.

Same camshafts, Airbox and exhaust as pre 2018? Same 8100 stock rev limit?

You can't get an answer on usable rpm range based on something that isn't even made yet.

[Spyd_Piper]

Exactly lol.... Disabled PC cores on chips etc.
That was my point....

20% gain on an ECU remap makes sense.
But if you're 95% of the way there on the S model...

Would really like some info on ECU remapping gains as it pertains to the 2017 F3-S models specifically.
Personally, I'd like a little more torque (down low before she howls/growls), but NOT at the expense of engine longevity/reliability. ~ Don't want to give up durability!

Contact them and ask for a money back guarantee. Buy it. Try it. Keep it or return to go back stock and get refund. I am sure they would do it.

[Bob Denman]

Same camshafts, Airbox and exhaust as pre 2018? Same 8100 stock rev limit?

You can't get an answer on usable rpm range based on something that isn't even made yet.

Oh! No change to the 2018 engines. They're the same as the 2014 to 2017 versions...

[Spyd_Piper]

Oh! No change to the 2018 engines. They're the same as the 2014 to 2017 versions...

Then its already been answered. But to sum it up again,
Peak power will be within the stock rev limit. You won't loose anything.
But it will pull to 8800. So each lower gear can be extended if you want to shift less. Or your riding style likes high rpm.
However, you stated you never go above 7000.
A good reserve (for future modifications or a new riding style) would be to limit at 8500-8600.
You also asked about warranty and the answer there was stay stock rev limiter.

[five-0]

Are you stating that with "torque limiter" removed or reduced i can go around a corner with one fronttire in the air and not be slowed down by the " nanny" and still stay on full power.

[TRLBLZR1]

Are you stating that with "torque limiter" removed or reduced i can go around a corner with one fronttire in the air and not be slowed down by the " nanny" and still stay on full power.

Two parts to the nanny. One is anti-tip which you can't avoid. (So no, you shouldn't have front tires off the ground for long lol/col.) But the other one is anti-slip (which on the 2017's at least) can be completely disabled. Haven't tried it yet because I have little interest in smoking off my tires. (Also seems rather difficult to do anyways on a SE model, unless disabling the anti-slip also enhances low-end torque.) = A question I've been meaning to ask!