Riding in tight formation at 75+ MPH.

[Casher50]

Recently I was with a group (mostly on Harleys) who were riding in tight formation at 75+ MPH. I insisted on bringing up the rear and leaving plenty of space to stop if need be. Riding like this is basically institutionalized tailgating, and I don't like it. However, I see it a lot as groups go by on the interstate. How can this be safe? What do you think?

[Easy Rider]

How can this be safe? What do you think?

It isn't safe......or sane either.
Every motorcycle training ever created specifically says to NOT do that.

I don't think that anybody ever claimed that ALL bike riders are smart; quite the contrary.

I don't ride with groups that insist on that kind of riding formation.
And it seems that there always are other reasons I don't seem to "fit in" too.

[Bob Denman]

"How can it be safe?"
it isn't...

[MercerLake]

I bring up the rear also with a group that I ride with, I can stop faster and don't want to be in the middle of a melee. They being in the lead get to clear the "Road Kill" before I get there! Only disadvantage is the noise, with a bunch speeding up and down to hear their pipes bark I guess.

[SPYD3R]

OMG, these riders OBVIOUSLY do not know that STUPID HURTS..... and can kill as well... but then again, it's their choice - none of my business.... just not my style...
for every 10mph of speed, be at the very least 1 car length, NOT bike length, behind the rider in from of you, even if you are on 2 wheels, and riding stagered....

what gets me are the ones with the monkey bars 9 feet in the air, no helmets, flip-flops and a T-shirt & cut-offs rolling down the highway at 75mph..... crazy...
jmho
Dan P
SPYD3R

[PaladinLV]

In order to answer, one must FIRST define what you perceive as TIGHT?

Harley chapters typically ride in staggered formation. With 2 seconds between the bike in front of you, and 1 second to the staggered rider on your left or right.

Past Director of Southern Nevada HOG
AJ

Recently I was with a group (mostly on Harleys) who were riding in tight formation at 75+ MPH. I insisted on bringing up the rear and leaving plenty of space to stop if need be. Riding like this is basically institutionalized tailgating, and I don't like it. However, I see it a lot as groups go by on the interstate. How can this be safe? What do you think?

[Gator37]

How can this be safe? What do you think?[/QUOTE]

Not SAFE and Not Smart.

[Arion]

In order to answer, one must FIRST define what you perceive as TIGHT?

Harley chapters typically ride in staggered formation. With 2 seconds between the bike in front of you, and 1 second to the staggered rider on your left or right.

Past Director of Southern Nevada HOG
AJ

Can't say if it's still correct, but at one time the MSF also taught the 2 second and 1 second mantra. Have to admit though, at my 7th decade age, two seconds isn't what is once was. I much prefer more than minimum spacing so I can be afforded a moment or two longer to respond to what my eyes see and my brain tries to interpret. And in my experience, in the "heat of the ride" too many group riders seem to forget the spacing recommendation and bunch up. It might look impressive but any escape route tends to vanish.

[Bandera]

When you ride in large groups, the norm is staggered and using the two second rule between you and the rider in front. If you did not do this, the line of motorcycles could go for miles.

I never ride the side by side, that is real dangerous.

I only ride with large groups for special events.

Regards,

Michael

[SPYD3R]

In order to answer, one must FIRST define what you perceive as TIGHT?

Harley chapters typically ride in staggered formation. With 2 seconds between the bike in front of you, and 1 second to the staggered rider on your left or right.

Past Director of Southern Nevada HOG
AJ

Paladin;
sorry to disagree with you, but 2 seconds can add up to be an accident...
try this: get with a friend, find a 2 lane road that is void of traffic.. tell your partner you want him/her to slam on their brakes without notifying you.... tell him/her to ride at 60mph in the left lane, while you ride 2 seconds behind him/her very much in the right lane... when he/she slams on their brakes, you'll notice that you'll be 30 - 50 feet in front of him/her by the time you are on your brakes.... where would you be if you were both in the same lane....?
try it, it's an eye openner... i want you and all other riders to be safe because riding is far too much fun to miss out on it because of an avoidable accident...
Dan P
SPYD3R

[Bob Denman]

Can't say if it's still correct, but at one time the MSF also taught the 2 second and 1 second mantra. Have to admit though, at my 7th decade age, two seconds isn't what is once was. I much prefer more than minimum spacing so I can be afforded a moment or two longer to respond to what my eyes see and my brain tries to interpret. And in my experience, in the "heat of the ride" too many group riders seem to forget the spacing recommendation and bunch up. It might look impressive but any escape route tends to vanish.

Ned.jpg

I know that it takes me longer to "sort things out" now; than it did several years ago.

[Vader]

Riding in formation, at highway speed, is a recipe for disaster. There is absolutely no reason for it. Riding in formation at slower speed, say a parade, can also lead to a painful experience unless practiced prior. Staggered riding, with at least a few car lengths between rides may be safe for those who are confident and comfortable with their abilities and those of their fellow riders.

[No 2817]

I have a limited number of "Group Rides" (5) and did not enjoy them one bit. This was all on Two wheeler's. I feel that the whole lane is mine. Not just half. I saw people riding with there front tire on the yellow line, with the handle bars over the line! With on coming traffic, not on a divided highway. I see this all time and don't get why some people think this is okay. I was taught never to ride right next to another bike. To answer your question: Not Safe, Not Smart.

Chris

[nealperkins]

It's not safe.
I had a friend that I told at lunch this at lunch and I left the group. In fact, I told him it was a mathematical certainty that something would eventually happen.He was dead at 2:00, shortly after I left the group. I miss him. Of course, I could really know it was certain, I just wanted to register my alarm. Group riding can certainly be safe but not if there are too many folks and some folks won't stay in 'their' position. That's just my opinion.

[d.o.spyder-rts]

Not smart or safe. Keep in mind the 2 second rule is the minimum distance between any vehicle. It should be consistently adjusted for road and traffic conditions. Dale

[ThreeWheels]

Sounds to me like a typical day on the Merrit Parkway going to work.

Tight Formation.jpg
Blue Angels at the NY Air Show

[Pirate looks at --]

Don't know what tight is, but we have been ryding in large groups for many years without incident. We may stretch that 2 seconds to 3, but if you are alert, and in control and maintain your spacing you should always have an out in case issues arise. We rode with a group of 8 from California to Valcourt without issue. It can be safe as long as all are alert and aware. We don't allow any alcohol consumption on any of our groups just to keep everybody alert.

[cyclekid58]

An incident happened to my wife 2 years ago riding in a staggered formation of 2 wheelers at about 35 to 45mph going onto a freeway from a ramp, when the leaders suddenly slowed fast as they reached the freeway, most reaction times are 2 seconds or more. Needless to say my wifes bike was clipped by the bike to her side, she avoided the one in front of her but the other girl was jostled off her bike, my wife went off hers and down. I narrowly avoided hitting the girl that landed on the road in front of me and only because of riding more than 2 seconds behind and the fantastic ABS on the Spyder. The bike to my right and behind me was a BMW with ABS who also was able to stop in time due to ABS on the BMW. Needless to say 2 surgeries and a year and a half recovery, she is now on a spyder and will never ride in a 2 wheeler group again. Our spyder club maintains a lot more distance between bikes. Take it from someone who has been there, the tight packs are not safe, the guy that rides the BMW also does run for the wall every year and has attended way too many accidents. Do what you want but distance is your friend.

[Gator37]

Maybe I'm getting to be a woose, but I try to avoid large group riding. Half a dozen like minded riders is about enough. At 80 and been riding off and on for 60 of those years I only ride at MY comfort level. Doesn't mean I'm slow, but I don't need to get anywhere in an unsafe hurry.

Ken, (Gator37)

[Samson]

Stupid! I won't ride in groups at all. It seems to me that the larger the group the fewer the brains and everyone becomes an 8th grader. I don't need to prove anything to anyone. I once saw a large group in California of about 100 bikes in a 2x2 line. There was an idiot that decided to do a wheelie right down the middle of them, worked well for about 200 feet then not so well. There was about 25 bikes that piled up. Bad, Bad.

[Bob Denman]

I once saw a large group in California of about 100 bikes in a 2x2 line. There was an idiot that decided to do a wheelie right down the middle of them, worked well for about 200 feet then not so well. There was about 25 bikes that piled up. Bad, Bad.

Groan....jpg

[hillbillywhisperer]

Yes, riding with a group in staggered formation is safe and there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. Although, if the group is large than it should be broken up into smaller groups. Spyder riders or other trikes should be placed in the rear.

[ARtraveler]

The bottom line for me is no way.

There are a couple local groups that ride just that way. 2 x 2 and at greater than highway speed (65). They look cool and usually are very loud. Sadly, they are only as strong as their weakest link. So far, so good. An accident will eventually happen.

The group I rode with used a staggered formation. That is better than 2 x 2. We also went down to 8 or less bikes per line. The last couple years, I was the safety person. I took on all the newbies and they had to ride in my group for starters. Politics and procedures were what caused me to leave the group. I don't miss the group rides at all. Experienced riders were becoming weak links. On one ride in the twisties I saw one of the lady riders cross the center line many times. After that ride, we were done.

[MurrayBrown]

In order to answer, one must FIRST define what you perceive as TIGHT? Harley chapters typically ride in staggered formation. With 2 seconds between the bike in front of you, and 1 second to the staggered rider on your left or right. Past Director of Southern Nevada HOG AJ

CORRECT! The only way to ride in a group is staggered, with the "timing" as per this note from Paladin.

I ride with a motorcycle riding group branch in Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada. We are a branch of a national association, Canadian Motorcycle Cruisers. Safety is Number One. No alcohol on any group rides, and follow the rules, which includes staggered riding. Trikes (Spyders, Harley trikes and Goldwing trikes) go to the rear. Groups are no more than 8 riders. If more, such as last night with 15 riders, two groups were created. Each one has a Road Captain (leader) and a Tailgunner. Since the trikes go to the rear, the riders of the trikes MUST be tested and signed off as Road Captains. They will never lead, but they MUST pass the same rules as the Road Captains.

Last night's ride was on a four-lane highway that allowed 120 km/h ... that is basically 75 mph.

If somebody knows how to save a PDF to this forum, I can do that. Otherwise if anybody wants a copy of the Rules, please send me a PM or e-mail me at murraygto@shaw.ca.
I can then send you a PDF file that shows the staggered rules and hand signals that are used.

[Allensr]

As with any other venture with risk, follow the rules use common sense and stay safe. Group riding is fun but you better know who you are riding with.
Allen